What’s the right decision here?

[Inky]

There you hit the nail right on its head!! This is the only solution to help these poor creatures, to get things legally regulated.

Let future keepers first mandatory do their homework and then sell them the supplies and when you take this serious, you can make more money as store, then they do now. Downside for them, is that truth in advance comes to play, and that´s that chameleons are pretty expensive when starting-up. However, once you invest correctly in the husbandry, it won´t cost that much any more. Point is, chameleons should be sold through reputable breeders only and stores let Petco should only sell supplies (bigger purchase orders, lower selling prices), next to not every single soul should breed them just for fun and some pocket change.

Sorry, this my honest opinion in this matter.

Regulations is the right solution I believe as well and we are the only ones that could make that a possibility. Educated people have to force the uneducated stores and sellers to make changes with how they raise and educate new time owners . that’s hard to do when uneducated people you are trying to change are just in it for money. They are blinded by profit. They lack the passion we have. I remember going to a privately owned pet store in my home town with my father when I was about 13-14 years old and they refused to sell to us because we had known nothing about its care.
I was a furious little boy but man oh man do I understand his refusal now.


I’d go to petco for the treats that show up once in a while like horn worms but I believe it’s best I just don’t do business there anymore after rehoming.

 

[Mountain Dragon]

Chameleon Owners should take the jobs of petco and petsmart and petsway! Jk bc they are giant and not everyone has time/position to do that. Cf to the rescue?

 

[Mountain Dragon]

I wish people could just educate the pet store workers and everything would be fine they have enough money to house them correctly they would only lose a lil Margain but also might gain some bc chameleon owners will be willingly to buy from there.

 

[Inky]

Very realistic way to look at things, you must have a strong grip on your emotions . Sometimes temptation overcomes me as a chameleon owner and that’s what I’d say that’s my issue.
I see it in the sense that since I’m capable I can and should.

it’s like any other thing we as people label as a “temptation”. something you probably shouldn’t do but do because emotions swayed you. That’s kinda how I’m feeling. Some people tackle temptation others fall victim to it.


People go so deep into discussing this. No amount of paragraphs will change the facts. It's the same stuff everytime, the emotional vs the logical(not an insult, just personality differences). From a logical standpoint, no you should not. There's no longterm benefit to chameleons when buying from Petco. Emotional, if it really helps you sleep and you'd really like 3 more veileds in your life, then buy them whatever. It isn't that significant overall. Not buying them goes back to the whole... if everyone does something, it will lead to a massive change. Letting them die is very utilitarian though and some people can't handle tha

 

[Mountain Dragon]

I wish people could just educate the pet store workers and everything would be fine they have enough money to house them correctly they would only lose a lil Margain but also might gain some bc chameleon owners will be willingly to buy from there.

Margin*

 

[jamest0o0]

You know the saying... the road to hell is paved with good intentions. NOT saying you're going to hell or you're a bad person haha. If you bought them right now I'd have nothing negative to say to you and I'd wish you the best, I'd even help if you needed help. Just bringing it up because the overall message is important. Almost everyone, everywhere has felt their heart was in the right place when they did things, some had very bad outcomes... So it's good to be mindful of that. The hard choice is often the right choice IMO. As a forum for overall chameleon well-being I don't think we should recommend Petco publicly. There are people here who get flamed for far less than what Petco does to millions of animals on a day to day basis.

 

[Mountain Dragon]

So here is the thing. Yes they will get more to replace the ones you buy. So yes the cycle repeats.

With the babies do you have the means to individually house them with all the correct stuff?

They would never be able to be bred to one another due to the high possibility of being related.

Big thing though. Do you have experience with Veileds? Most act like moody toddlers. Their personality is very different from a gentle Panther. Don't get me wrong I adore my boy and adore this species but it can be a shocker for those less familiar with their feisty personality and mood swings.

I bought two of mine from Petco within the first week they had gotten them in. Both were parasite free and very healthy. Key is getting them before they have had time to hurt them. I would still recommend a fecal though before introducing them to any area you have other chameleons in just to be safe.

Oh no the moody toddlers part made me think of this. My three year old brother who o babaysit alotttttt sticks up his toe and says WANNA SUCKER I just realized this and it will be stuck in my head forever but when the chameleon lifts his foot for a defensive move a lil voice in my head will say WANNA SUCKEr!

 

[MissSkittles]

I wish people could just educate the pet store workers and everything would be fine they have enough money to house them correctly they would only lose a lil Margain but also might gain some bc chameleon owners will be willingly to buy from there.

It’s not the workers in the pet stores…it’s corporate. The corporate big wigs come up with their policies and procedures and the workers have to follow them. Change is possible, but at this point, unlikely. Years ago the puppy mills were more than happy to provide millions of sick puppies to Petco and the like. Then the public learned what goes on and the outrage changed the policies and laws. The same needs to happen again, but for reptiles. Unfortunately, most people don’t see snakes and lizards as ‘cute’ enough to care about.

 

[Inky]

You know the saying... the road to hell is paved with good intentions. NOT saying you're going to hell or you're a bad person haha. If you bought them right now I'd have nothing negative to say to you and I'd wish you the best, I'd even help if you needed help. Just bringing it up because the overall message is important. Almost everyone, everywhere has felt their heart was in the right place when they did things, some had very bad outcomes... So it's good to be mindful of that. The hard choice is often the right choice IMO. As a forum for overall chameleon well-being I don't think we should recommend Petco publicly. There are people here who get flamed for far less than what Petco does to millions of animals on a day to day basis.

I respect not recommending petco.
It’s the logical choice and makes a lot of sense
As opposed to the emotional choice.

 

[Mountain Dragon]

It’s not the workers in the pet stores…it’s corporate. The corporate big wigs come up with their policies and procedures and the workers have to follow them. Change is possible, but at this point, unlikely. Years ago the puppy mills were more than happy to provide millions of sick puppies to Petco and the like. Then the public learned what goes on and the outrage changed the policies and laws. The same needs to happen again, but for reptiles. Unfortunately, most people don’t see snakes and lizards as ‘cute’ enough to care about.

Ahhhh okay

 

[JacksJill]

The big pet store chains make their money selling mostly useless, often dangerous stuff, as someone recently put it "the pet store making about 400 dollars off of a 16 year kid". The money from the chameleon is nothing to them it is just the lure ro sell the other crap. I will only ever buy anything from them out of total desperation. I won't buy any products from them in person or on line as long as they torture small animals for ill gotten profits.
Make the best decision your heart and your head will let you but don't buy any items there ever.

 

[Inky]

The big pet store chains make their money selling mostly useless, often dangerous stuff, as someone recently put it "the pet store making about 400 dollars off of a 16 year kid". The money from the chameleon is nothing to them it is just the lure ro sell the other crap. I will only ever buy anything from them out of total desperation. I won't buy any products from them in person or on line as long as they torture small animals for ill gotten profits.
Make the best decision your heart and your head will let you but don't buy any items there ever.

well said. Taking this insight.

 

[Lindasjackson]

I agree jacksjill and petco isn’t the only pet store like this, there are more.

 

[PlanetRemulak]

I agree jacksjill and petco isn’t the only pet store like this, there are more.

Absolutely true. Actual store fronts that sell animals, aren‘t focused exclusively on profits and are genuinely knowledgeable/passionate about the animals they sell are a very rare find.

 

[Lindasjackson]

Exactly!

 

[Lindasjackson]

That being said, where can I buy crickets online that don’t require me to buy 500? I just don’t have the room nor do I want to care for that many crickets! I only go into petco for 20-30 crickets at a time. I would rather buy them online but I just do not want a huge amount of them.

 

[JacksJill]

Buy the 500 but buy them 2 or three sizes smaller than you need and feed more early on and less as they grow. Or buy sample packs/variety packs that have a few assorted insects you will get less crickets that way. Or find another herper to split the order with.

 

[Lindasjackson]

Great advice jacksjill, I will look into that! I can’t buy 500, I have no where to keep them and they die off too fast but I could look into sample packs. I need some Dubia and some crickets on pay day so I will check on that. I bought like 20 Dubia s a month ago and not one died! I fed them all to Eustis and they lasted a month! I also fed crickets and bsfl as well so that’s why they lasted so long.

 

[Klyde O'Scope]

That being said, where can I buy crickets online that don’t require me to buy 500? I just don’t have the room nor do I want to care for that many crickets! I only go into petco for 20-30 crickets at a time. I would rather buy them online but I just do not want a huge amount of them.

I do similar. A couple of local pet stores (not the big-boxes) have crix, so I've been getting 50 LG at a time. I have a cricket keeper; they last me about a week, ± Sometimes I only lose a few; other imes I lose half or more. Those I've been getting lately don't die off as fast, and don't chirp (YAY!)

But I also keep dubias and lay in small supplies (100 ea.) supers & giant mealies.

 

[MissSkittles]

Check out http://www.lindasgonebuggie.com/ She sells 100 crickets along with just about every other feeder you’d want.