wild veileds in florida

This has been posted a few times in the past, but is an interesting read for those that haven't read it yet! :)
 
merumontanus said:
Cool to know? How is the introduction of non-native species that can potentially and negatively affect local ecosystems be cool?

Unbelievable.
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For what it's worth the studies suggest that only if it does impact the surrounding wildlife should the chameleons be removed. This was written in 2003 and they still exist there today. I would assume the direct impact is not so high, even though Veilds are notorious for being bad in some areas...Maui for one.
 
This is bad:(... It is things like this that will eventually start to put a strangle hold on the hobby. Anyone who has owned a Veiled should know how they are... They will eat anything in front of them that may be smaller than their head...Which includes plants, birds, any and all insects, small mammals, other native lizards and the list goes on. We know how prolifically they breed and how rapidly they consume. We may be lucky enough that they can find their niche there without excessive disruption, but in any case... this should be avoided, the impact on an ecosystem can be very serious.

~Joe
 
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merumontanus said:
Cool to know? How is the introduction of non-native species that can potentially and negatively affect local ecosystems be cool?

Unbelievable.
Click to expand...


were not talking anacondas/constrictors here..

i guess if it got out of hand it wouldnt be..i just think its cool that they can hold thier own naturally in florida.. sorry if i offended you...:)

but i would think there are enough natural preditors/elements in that area to keep the pop in line..
 
All of you Florida peeps should go out and catch as many as you can. Would be fun... and would defiantly help keep populations down enough to prevent them from getting to the point of being put on a list for "eradication".
 
i second that..

but do you really think enough would survive to pose a threat on the ecosystem...?? seems a lil far fetched to me..but i could be wrong..:)
 
Right, that's what Australian settlers probably said when introducing one of the most detrimental pests in the history of the continent: "but they're just cute, little, bunnies." Except they're now responsible for the extinction of countless of native species, some of them endemic.

I'm not claiming that veileds are nearly as destructive as the Australian rabbits or Guam's brown tree snakes, but to dismiss the potential danger of their introduction into any non-native habitat because they're not large, scary, snakes is ludicrous.

Asian long-horn beetles are also not anacondas, but they are responsible for killing so many trees every year in North America that it is becoming an environmental crisis.
 
merumontanus said:
Right, that's what Australian settlers probably said when introducing one of the most detrimental pests in the history of the island: "but they're just cute, little, bunnies." Except they're now responsible for the extinction of countless of native species, some of them endemic.

I'm not claiming that veileds are nearly as destructive as the Australian rabbits or Guam's brown tree snakes, but to dismiss the potential danger of their introduction into any non-native habitat because they're not large, scary, snakes is ludicrous.

Asian long-horn beetles are also not anacondas, but they are responsible for killing so many trees every year in North America that it is becoming an environmental crisis.
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i agree, and i see the issue at hand..imho,i just dont see veileds being a huge threat...its surprising their surviving at all..
 
No disrespect intended in any way FE...but I am actually not to surprised that they are surviving down there. I am by no means an expert on animal populations and locations. But from the amount of research I have done I would not be surprised if there were as many, if not more possible predators to Chams in their natural habitats in Africa and Madagascar than in southern Florida. An animal that produces such large clutches of young in reproduction, is one that is equipped take losses, and still survive hostile environments.

As a cham keeper and "enthusiast" i guess you could say, I also found it intriguing to learn that they can and sometimes do survive in our local areas as wild populations. You can probably find a thread on here somewhere from a while back of me all excited about wild jax. I have since done more research into these kinds of cases.

For the sake of the local ecosystem and for the sake of our hobby... We should never purposely release our animals. As has been stated above... Introducing foreign species into an environment has and still is proving to be a bad idea. IMHO I really think that these populations should be gotten under control as soon as possible in some way... Before we start having threads on here about how the wildlife agencies are killing Florida Veileds, and banning trade and ownership. This is more than a possibility in cases like this... we should try to nip it in the butt.

We need to identify the locations they are inhabiting, and some may not agree... But I believe we should start removing as many as possible from the wild and try placing them in homes with the intent f at some point getting them all. It may not be possible to remove the entire wild breeding population and future generations right away, but if it was done consistently enough for a span of time.. I believe we may be able to fix "our bad" in the most humane way possible. Maybe I am a disgusting optimist, but I think it is worth a shot. If someone were able to start capturing some.. I would be willing to help in any way possible from the west coast as far as finding good homes for them to go to or whatever else.

Man! there is no body here to shut me up when I'm alone typing:eek:...sorry:D


~Joe
 
Cameron B said:
This is already done. It's not like it's picking a chameleon off of a rock. They run for over $200 at time...one that comes to mind:

http://www.lostlakechameleons.com/veiled.html
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Oh I know you can find WC Florida Chams already...I am just suggesting maybe it should be focused on more as some kind of conservation effort... We obviously know where to catch them... now lets focus on trying to get ridiculous amounts of them... If we can do this we may avoid a bigger issue all together. Maybe someone who only focuses on capturing, acclimating, and rehoming WC Florida Veileds, not breeding... just focusing on getting this population of chams out of the wild before it becomes a real problem.

EDIT: I would never try to incinuate you would FE:) Hope I'm not steping on toes.. Every once in a while I love a good discussion like this.
 
i live in the area where the article claims that they are present, but i have never come across one. i agree that they should be removed and i would get them myself if i have ever seen them around. i think that if they started a big enough population they would be too much competetion for the native anoles. look at how many brown anoles you see in florida, they were introduced here from cuba. and they have pretty much taken over the niche of the green anole
 
I agree guys. Hey maby I should get one of them instead of getting one from a breeder. I would love to help in a way of rehabilatating FL Chams. And couldnt you theoreticly keep them in a large cage outside, since they are used to the FL Climate? Hey maby we can make up a VCRT "Veiled Chameleon Rehab Team". We could catch Veiled (I spelt it right, lol) Chameleons, rehabilatate them, then find them new homes. Im up for it, anyone else like this Idea
 
I live over in the Miami/Ft. Lauderdale area and would be happy to do some day trips or weekend trips over to collect veileds in Naples or Ft. Myers if someone can identify where the population is located. Unless I missed it, the article didn't say specifically where they were found.
 
We should also note, Acclimating a WC is no easy task, often requires a lot of time, money, and experience to make sure you QT and treat properly for any possible parasites, and provide required veterinary attention to those who need it. All of this would be on top of ... Finding out where the populations are living and start spending enough time in the field to make a difference. Another aspect would be the extended amounts of time that would need to spent recording data from the field on the effect they are having on the ecosystem... as well as any progress that is being made. I think it would be great if someone in FL could get something like this going...But as you can tell it would not be an easy task, And would take a good amount of time, money, experience, comitment, and patience. i would love to quit my day job and dedicate it to projects like this... But unfotunately that is not possible.
 
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