Another male veiled with right eye closed... and a UV light discovery

[Trestlechild]

Chameleon Info:

• Your Chameleon - About a year and a half I think.
• Handling - As infrequently as possible. He's a grump who prefers to be left alone. I let him free range sometimes, maybe three days a week, and I sometimes handle him to put him back in the cage for feeding.
• Feeding - Crickets and hornworms. 6-8 large crickets every two to three days plus a hornworm is typical. But sometimes he gets either all crickets or all hornworms. As far as gutloading the crickets goes I let the pet store handle that. The store feeds them water crystals and what I think is flukers cricket cubes or C3. The hornworms eat chow. They're from Josh's Frogs.
• Supplements - Since I'm not very confident in the pet store's gutload, I give extra multivitamin. So they Supplement schedule is Exo Terra calcium and multivitamin dusting with each feeding and I swap the Exo Terra calcium for Flukers Repta Calcium with D3 twice a month.
• Watering - He gets 1,000 ML of water per day from a sprayer. That's enough to soak his cage and require me to mop up extra frequently.
• Fecal Description - Excrement looks good. Poop is brown and solid and smooth, urate is mainly white. For the last couple weeks, however, he has been getting more orange on the tips. We've been out of hornwoms and I reduced his spraying at the same time because his pothos were showing signs of root rot or maybe a leaf fungus. So I think right now his hydration is a little off.
• History - I rescued this cham. Previous owner had him from baby through about 8 months old. He was very very poorly cared for (basically not cared for at all) so I worry about long term complications.

Cage Info:

• Cage Type - It's the big repti breeze. 4 feet tall by 2x2 If I recall correctly.
• Lighting - ***From 7 am until 7 pm hes got a 36in t5 quad from Light Your Reptiles with a 6% uv bulb, a grow light and two daylight bulbs. From 8 am through 6 pm he has an 80w Solar Glo from Exo Terra and an incandescent heat bulb. This way it's more like a real day where in the morning and evening it's a little cooler *** There's more about this in the current problem section.
• Temperature - Cage floor is 74F right now. Basking spot has some variation because of the shape of the branch there. Coolest part of the basking spot I just measured at 92F and the hottest was 110F. He's usually in the middle. Lowest overnight temp is maybe 60 in the winter. Measured with an IR gun
• Humidity - I don't check humidity. It's fairly humid where I live and he's hydrated.
• Plants - There's three live pothos in his cage. They are struggling. There was a fourth one but I took it out because it was dying. I think from over watering. If it comes back I'll put it back.
• Placement - Cage is in a corner nook in my office. It's a low traffic area. Theres a fan and a vent in the room but he is tucked away off to the side. Cage top is about 6 feet off the floor.
• Location - Beautiful San Marvelous Texas.

Current Problem - Keeps his right eye closed a lot. At first I thought he was just closing the eye that was pointed up at the lights when he sort of lays over to bask, so closing it seemed reasonable since that quad light is dang bright. I don't like looking at them either. But then he started keeping it closed other times too. Now it's closed most of the time and he basically only opens it if he notices me getting close to him or when he's travelling around. It's even closed when he's chillin' outside the cage. So I was thinking maybe vitamin A like in a few other threads but it's been going on for at least a month, and it seems like he would be closing both eyes if it were vitamin A problems. Is it ok to give him vitamin A and see what happens? or will that be too much since I already supplement him so much.

*** More about lights *** As I was looking at pictures to upload in this thread I noticed not all of his lights were on in the quad. Two of the bulbs (the two that get hit by some water when I spray him) were out. One of them was the 6% UVB. Now that I'm thinking UVB issues some other symptoms come to mind, like he doesn't seem to stand as tall as he used to. You can see that in one pic. He does have a sturdy grip and he does like to bask under the Solar Glo, so he's not totally devoid of UVB.
I don't have another t5 UVB so I'm going to be shopping. Should I get 6 or 12% with the Solar Glo in there? Or a reptisun? Maybe get another Solar Glo and replace the incandescent with it and then just put daylight bulbs in the quad?

Pics attached are before and after he noticed me taking his picture plus one of him under the Solar Glo

 

[JacksJill]

If you think his hydration is a bit off you can always give him showers. This will sometimes help remove any debris that could be irritating his eye as well. If the problem persists and your husbandry ie. temps, humidity, gut load and supplements aren't found to be the problem the vet is the next option.
Care sheet for recommended temps etc. https://www.chameleonforums.com/care/caresheets/veiled/
"Shower - Another method of providing water, especially to dehydrated chameleons, is by using a shower. Place a large plant in the tub, aim the shower head against the wall, and run the water so that only a fine mist reaches the chameleon. The water should be room temperature (not hot!). They may drink for up to 30 minutes. Make sure to supervise your chameleon at all times while using this method."

 

[JacksJill]

I would advise against that much vitamin supplement. It is possible to over do fat soluble vitamins. The popular wisdom is to only give it every two weeks or use a product like Repashy Low D that is formulated for daily dosing.

 

[Trestlechild]

If you think his hydration is a bit off you can always give him showers. This will sometimes help remove any debris that could be irritating his eye as well. If the problem persists and your husbandry ie. temps, humidity, gut load and supplements aren't found to be the problem the vet is the next option.
Care sheet for recommended temps etc. https://www.chameleonforums.com/care/caresheets/veiled/
"Shower - Another method of providing water, especially to dehydrated chameleons, is by using a shower. Place a large plant in the tub, aim the shower head against the wall, and run the water so that only a fine mist reaches the chameleon. The water should be room temperature (not hot!). They may drink for up to 30 minutes. Make sure to supervise your chameleon at all times while using this method."

I've showered him before with good results. I'm not all that worried about the hydration though. He's drinking and hornworms are on the way.

 

[JacksJill]

It is a good way to help them clean their eyes, hydration is just a bonus.

 

[Trestlechild]

It is a good way to help them clean their eyes, hydration is just a bonus.

Ok sounds like it's worth a shot

 

[Trestlechild]

I would advise against that much vitamin supplement. It is possible to over do fat soluble vitamins. The popular wisdom is to only give it every two weeks or use a product like Repashy Low D that is formulated for daily dosing.

Im glad to know about a daily dose multi vite. Are there other brands too?

 

[JacksJill]

That's the only one I know.

 

[kinyonga]

Don't rely on the pet store to feed/gutlaod crickets properly. What you're saying they're using is not good. Feed/gutload them with dandelion greens, kale, collards, endive, escarole, squash, zucchini, carrots, sweet potato, sweet red pepper,...and a bit of fruit such as berries, apple, pear, melon, etc.

It's important to dust the insects properly too. Using a phosphorous-free calcium powder at almost all the feedings and a phosphorous-free calcium/D3 powder twice a month and a vitamin powder with a beta carotene prOformed source of vitamin A twice a month.

The phosphorous-free calcium helps make up for the usually poor ratio of calcium to phosphorous found in most feeder ninsects. The phosphorous-free calcium/D3 powder provides some D3 without overdosing it and letting the chameleon produce the rest from its exposure to the UVB. The vitamin powder with the beta carotene won't overdose the vitamin A and leaves it up to you as to whether or not you use a prEformed source of vitamin A.

Appropriate temperatures aid indigestion and thus play a part in nutrient absorption.

As for the eye...there are many reasons why a chameleon will be shutting it's eye...and I can not tell you which of them pertains to your chameleon.

 

[Trestlechild]

That's the only one I know.

I ordered some thanks

Don't rely on the pet store to feed/gutlaod crickets properly. What you're saying they're using is not good. Feed/gutload them with dandelion greens, kale, collards, endive, escarole, squash, zucchini, carrots, sweet potato, sweet red pepper,...and a bit of fruit such as berries, apple, pear, melon, etc.

It's important to dust the insects properly too. Using a phosphorous-free calcium powder at almost all the feedings and a phosphorous-free calcium/D3 powder twice a month and a vitamin powder with a beta carotene prOformed source of vitamin A twice a month.

The phosphorous-free calcium helps make up for the usually poor ratio of calcium to phosphorous found in most feeder ninsects. The phosphorous-free calcium/D3 powder provides some D3 without overdosing it and letting the chameleon produce the rest from its exposure to the UVB. The vitamin powder with the beta carotene won't overdose the vitamin A and leaves it up to you as to whether or not you use a prEformed source of vitamin A.

Appropriate temperatures aid indigestion and thus play a part in nutrient absorption.

As for the eye...there are many reasons why a chameleon will be shutting it's eye...and I can not tell you which of them pertains to your chameleon.

My past attempts at gutloading myself have been failures. They always result in dead bugs and moldy food. I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong, but anyway that's why I feed the way I do. :/ Thanks for the input

 

[jcarlsen]

I ordered some thanks


My past attempts at gutloading myself have been failures. They always result in dead bugs and moldy food. I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong, but anyway that's why I feed the way I do. :/ Thanks for the input

For gutloading, have you tried Repashy's bug burger or superload? Comes in a powder that you can make into a gel with hot water. Much better than the Fluker's stuff you find in most pet stores. The other thing with gutloading is you need to keep doing it at home, unless you're feeding off all the crickets and stuff once you get them from the store?

Also, I have to say that eye also looks sunken in. I wonder if there's something else ailing him. Have you been able to get his poop tested for parasites before?

 

[jcarlsen]

apologies for the double post, can't seem to delete it lol

 

[kinyonga]

So it's better to feed the chameleon insects that have been poorly fed/gutloaded by the stores than to learn how to do it properly? Not meant to be harsh....just wondering.