Been awhile (MERU PICS)

[merumontanus]

in this genus it's usually better to have chameleons with a bit too less than too much weight

At the risk of appearing to contradict myself, I have to agree with you here, but let me put it in context. Obesity in captive reptiles is a widespread problem seen not only in the "hobby" but also in the zoological field. It's a very common occurrence in ophidians, especially, where size (not necessarily age) play a big role in the female's ability to breed. So yes, obesity can lead to many serious problems, including liver disease, heart problems, etc. But given that many of these species are very difficult to acclimate and actually stimulate to feed (hence the use of arachnids and other arthropods), the practice of restricting food should be reserved for non-problematic species such as pardalis, calyptratus, etc, and for established (either CB or WC) specimens of other species, including "montanes".

In certain situations, such as with females of deremensis, over-eating is a huge problem that may lead to premature death or complications during oviposition (Eric can chime in on this with personal experience, I am sure), and this is true whether they are captive-bred, wild, established or not. But in general terms, as mentioned in my last post, I would feel much more comfortable about having to control the feeding frequency (or contents) of an established specimen, than to deal with an animal that refuses to eat, as it is most often the case with imports of the Trioceros genus.

Cheers,

Fabián

P.S. I can't wait to trade some captive-born merumontanus, Edward!

EDIT:

I've never said that he is fat - he has just to much meat on his bones. Espacially the feet and the tail look very stable - a bit too stable.
Chameleons (and all other reptils ) store the fat at first in their organs, at the kidney and the liver.

Just read this. I could not agree more. And I must rephrase what I wrote above, and apply it to our own species, especially in this country. I hope you don't mind my stealing of your phrase here when talking about human obesity: "You're not fat. Just a bit too stable."

Cheers, Benny!

 

[eisentrauti]

Well explained, as always Just remember, it's not my native language and so it's sometimes not so easy to explain things as well as native speakers do

 

[merumontanus]

Well explained, as always Just remember, it's not my native language and so it's sometimes not so easy to explain things as well as native speakers do

No worries! Your English is superb, Benny. It is also not my first language-- that's Spanish.

Saludos!

Fabián

 

[eisentrauti]

Thanks ! Unfortunately my teachers don't share this opinion in the past

Cheers Benny

 

[THECHAMMAN]

Fabian, english is my shared 1st language, deutch ist die andere halfte.

 

[mattjillson]

That Meru isn't fat, just big boned with a great personality! Hahaha. Sorry, had to. I love how soft and smooth that male's skin seems, living the good life for sure. Good to see updated pics Ed, better luck next time with the female.

 

[merumontanus]

Fabian, english is my shared 1st language, deutch ist die andere halfte.

One day I'll learn German, so I can visit (and understand) all the great European herpetology sites. So, in order to avoid a derailment of Ed's thread and stay within topic, how do you say "My Mount Meru Jackson's chameleon is not fat, just a bit too stable" in German?

Also, thanks for the necropsy photo, Edward. I'll add it to my reference "library" if you don't mind. I have a couple merumontanus necropsy photos as well somewhere... will dig them out soon, as well.

Fabián

 

[Edward Kim]

Socalson,

I usually feed them spiders I find at work and home (-black widows). I attached some pics of moths and common spiders I tend to feed them.
Note: I pinch off the fangs of the garden spiders prior to feeding (just in case). Another note: They love the daddy long leg varieties.

Cheers,

Edward Kim

 

[THECHAMMAN]

fabian, i did this a bit roughly and quickly but here

Mein Berg Meru Jackson's Chamäleon ist nicht Fett, nur ein bisschen zu stabilen

 

[Eric Adrignola]

Though I have not seen it myself, I have read that coccidia can cause similar looking problems in the kidneys.

 

[Kent67]

Reading this reminded me of one of the first people I met in this hobby. It was back in the very early 90s. I was looking for Jackson's and there were a few people known to be producing them from time to time in San Diego. I was introduced to one of them by my coworker. Her name was Margaret and she taught me much of what led to my initial successes with chameleons. At any rate, she had a 1.2 trio of xanths that were more obese than any chameleon, well, any reptile, I've seen since. They looked like little green Michelin men with big fat rolls. The male was also longer than any I've seen since. They were all captive born and the male was 5 years and the females 3. In addition to the usual pet store faire, she raised her own wax worms and fed them lots of garden snails but I never figured out how they got so big. I can remember wondering if that was what all cb were supposed to look like.