Chain Pet Supply Stores

[Rogue]

I am sure I am about to open a can of worms, but I wanted to vent a little. Tonight the husband and I had to swing by a major pet supply chain for supplies. We were out of town so we never visit this location. We walked by their reptile section and when I saw where they normally keep their chams for sale, I had hoped to see it empty. I wasn't so lucky. Not only did they have juvenile/almost adult sized chams, but they were housing 3 in a container less than 2 feet wide and maybe a foot and a half tall. I didn't see them all at first because all 3 were so brown in color that they blended in with the awful wood substrate. I got closer and noticed they had a Veiled, a Jackson, and a Panther all together! All 3 were as dark as mud. It broke my heart. I wanted to take a picture but I was being closely watched after telling some customers who were ooohing and awwwwing that sure, buy one, if they want a minimum of a $300 vet bill and a very sick animal that will most likely pass regardless. All they had was a small dripper. A cricket walked by the Jackson and it didn't look at the cricket. My question is how in the hell they got the Jackson and Panther? I've known them to sell Veiled, but never any other types of chams. Ugh I wanted to cry!

 

[Matt Vanilla Gorilla]

Did the name of the store start with a "p" and end with "co". I have seen them to carry all three in the past. Poor, poor chameleons! Doomed! Like in the "Saw" movies!

 

[Rogue]

Did the name of the store start with a "p" and end with "co". I have seen them to carry all three in the past. Poor, poor chameleons! Doomed! Like in the "Saw" movies!

It's awful. And if you buy a vowel, you are correct. Thankfully the ones by our house have had empty cham cages for months now. I hope it stays that way. I was also shocked by how big they were. They were at least 8 months old.

 

[Longhorn1234]

When you guys say that chameleons from chain stores are doomed, do you guys say that because of the amount of time they have been neglected in the store, or because of the suppliers that these stores get their chameleons from?

 

[funnyCAT140]

When you guys say that chameleons from chain stores are doomed, do you guys say that because of the amount of time they have been neglected in the store, or because of the suppliers that these stores get their chameleons from?

It's a mixture of both.

 

[Matt Vanilla Gorilla]

During dark times in human history experiments were done on human babies. Though all their basic needs were taken care of, babies that did not receive love, cuddles and attention died.

 

[jamest0o0]

Confused by this ^ are you saying we need to cuddle our chameleons?

 

[OldChamKeeper]

Matt cuddles his chameleons. It should be noted however that his are plush toys. He can't go to sleep with the lights off or if "Mr Scales" his stuffed Jackson plushie, is not with him.

No, don't cuddle your chameleons... also don't buy stuff from stores that can't keep their stock properly.

 

[Melodie21]

Thats so sad poor chameleons i got mine from petsmart where i live he was in a cage by himself when he was a two month old juvenile veiled chameleon named clyde and hes 7 months old and doing great they took good care of him when he was little

 

[Kaden]

I try never to shop at Petco or Petsmart but a few months ago someone threw out a kitten that was only a few days old (still had ambelical chord attached) and I had to go there every week or so to buy kitten replacement milk. The reptile section broke my heart as all of them were in terrible conditions. They had 3 veileds (luckily all babies) in a glass cage. I'm in southeast Texas where its very humid all year long so glass is a huge no no here. They had no dripper and when I asked, the employee said he misted them down only a few times a week. There were a few large crickets in the bottom of the enclosure all of which were WAY to big for the tiny babies. I know the government doesn't care about reptiles but there still should be SOME laws regarding them because the care given to these delicate creatures is just sickening.

 

[Matt Vanilla Gorilla]

My point was not to cuddle with your chameleon my point was that when basic needs are barely taken care of but important stuff for well beig is left out during the earliest phase of development death is often inevitable! No matter what you try to do to save them, it is often to late and if you do pull them through they will usually have a short sickly life.

 

[jamest0o0]

I was just being a smartass in this situation are you talking about keeping them fully hydrated due to possible permanent kidney damage?

 

[OldChamKeeper]

Here's a few tips for those not in the know concerning big box pet stores:

1 - they make their profits off the dry goods. If they sell you a lizard they don't make money on it unless you buy dry goods.

Lesson- buy all your dry goods online or from mom and pop stores

2- Always Always Always call animal control. Make it clear in your call you are not some bleeding heart PETA fanatic. Just say you have extensive experience with reptiles and explain the stupid shit or sick animals you are seeing. Always get the name of who you speak with. Why.....

Lesson-... because most likely nothing will be done on your first call. Revisit the store 48 hrs later and if nothing has changed you call back animal control and speak to a supervisor. Explain the issue and toss the first person you spoke to under the bus. You'll get results that same day. Also if you really give a shit you then contact your local council member about the shitty service you got from AC. It's about speaking clearly and being persistent

Lastly, snap a picture if you can. Good ones can be used by AC and it doesn't hurt to email it to your council member. If you are lucky the council member might be a pet person too

 

[Rogue]

Here's a few tips for those not in the know concerning big box pet stores:

1 - they make their profits off the dry goods. If they sell you a lizard they don't make money on it unless you buy dry goods.

Lesson- buy all your dry goods online or from mom and pop stores

2- Always Always Always call animal control. Make it clear in your call you are not some bleeding heart PETA fanatic. Just say you have extensive experience with reptiles and explain the stupid shit or sick animals you are seeing. Always get the name of who you speak with. Why.....

Lesson-... because most likely nothing will be done on your first call. Revisit the store 48 hrs later and if nothing has changed you call back animal control and speak to a supervisor. Explain the issue and toss the first person you spoke to under the bus. You'll get results that same day. Also if you really give a shit you then contact your local council member about the shitty service you got from AC. It's about speaking clearly and being persistent

Lastly, snap a picture if you can. Good ones can be used by AC and it doesn't hurt to email it to your council member. If you are lucky the council member might be a pet person too

I might see if I can sneak back in there to snap a picture. They each were at least 7 months old and barely had room to move. I kid you not, they all 3 were dark as mud. Barely any sign of color or markings. They sadly were already in poor health. Plus, i'm no expert, but housing a jackson, Panther and veiled together could not be a healthy environment on top of the tiny enclosure and they were all being fed the exact same diet (dried up veggies in a reptile bowl and only a cricket or two roaming freely that not a single cham paid any attention to), and only a little dripper. Who knows if they were different sexes at that!

 

[OldChamKeeper]

I might see if I can sneak back in there to snap a picture. They each were at least 7 months old and barely had room to move. I kid you not, they all 3 were dark as mud. Barely any sign of color or markings. They sadly were already in poor health. Plus, i'm no expert, but housing a jackson, Panther and veiled together could not be a healthy environment on top of the tiny enclosure and they were all being fed the exact same diet (dried up veggies in a reptile bowl and only a cricket or two roaming freely that not a single cham paid any attention to), and only a little dripper. Who knows if they were different sexes at that!

You can explain to AC that it is common knowledge among chameleon keepers and current literature that keeping different chameleon species together in such a small habitat will cause stress and illness. in addition to explaining one of those three species is a desert species and another a tropical one...that might make sense to them.

For example, the veiled comes Yemen while Jackson's thrive in Hawaii ...little intelligent snipits of info like that resonate with the person you mat be talking to.

 

[Franquixote]

Talk to the manager and hand him one of our FAQs to copy for his employees. IME people that work at pet stores aren't generally prone to abuse animals, just ignorant on certain things and low paid.
For what it's worth, I've seen even worse conditions in mom and pop shops- exponentially worse- especially in shops that "specialize" in reptiles. They tend to take on too many species and care for each species sporadically.

 

[Rogue]

Talk to the manager and hand him one of our FAQs to copy for his employees. IME people that work at pet stores aren't generally prone to abuse animals, just ignorant on certain things and low paid.
For what it's worth, I've seen even worse conditions in mom and pop shops- exponentially worse- especially in shops that "specialize" in reptiles. They tend to take on too many species and care for each species sporadically.

Heartbreaking. Unfortunately that store isn't near us and is out of town for us, but I might just send them an e-mail.

 

[Rogue]

I took it upon myself to call said store and asked if they had any of the three chameleons left. She said they only had the female Jackson left (there was no laying bin in the viv!). I was floored. I looked up their corporate page and they actually have a public code of ethics in PDF which include proper animal health and care. I printed it out, got info on their corporate office, and logged the date I was there and the conversation I had this morning with their associate. I will be sending them a letter including their copy of the code of ethics and explain how they are killing and mistreating these animals. Just because a viper, boa, and python are all snakes, you don't cage them together. I am hoping to have the letter mailed by Friday. I could call their toll-free number but I feel a letter has more meaning.

 

[OldChamKeeper]

For what it's worth, I've seen even worse conditions in mom and pop shops- exponentially worse- especially in shops that "specialize" in reptiles. They tend to take on too many species and care for each species sporadically.

There are two kinds of mom and pop shops. Really.

There are the ones who have the same business mentality as big box stores, that pushing out as many animals as possible leads to profit.

Then there are the ones that believe quality assistance, healthy animals, and variety will lead to profit. My boss's stores were in this category. Despite that, over time Petsmart put him out. You just can't sell live animals alone in this market. In the case of my local reptile shop they make a huge amount of their monthly profits off of selling live feeders and a huge variety at that.

 

[ChamNewbie6540]

I am sure I am about to open a can of worms, but I wanted to vent a little. Tonight the husband and I had to swing by a major pet supply chain for supplies. We were out of town so we never visit this location. We walked by their reptile section and when I saw where they normally keep their chams for sale, I had hoped to see it empty. I wasn't so lucky. Not only did they have juvenile/almost adult sized chams, but they were housing 3 in a container less than 2 feet wide and maybe a foot and a half tall. I didn't see them all at first because all 3 were so brown in color that they blended in with the awful wood substrate. I got closer and noticed they had a Veiled, a Jackson, and a Panther all together! All 3 were as dark as mud. It broke my heart. I wanted to take a picture but I was being closely watched after telling some customers who were ooohing and awwwwing that sure, buy one, if they want a minimum of a $300 vet bill and a very sick animal that will most likely pass regardless. All they had was a small dripper. A cricket walked by the Jackson and it didn't look at the cricket. My question is how in the hell they got the Jackson and Panther? I've known them to sell Veiled, but never any other types of chams. Ugh I wanted to cry!

That's awful. I wish animal cruelty would just be a thing of the past already...