Chameleon won't move

[zmyers]

So this morning I went over to my cage as soon as I woke up to change the my chameleon(Karma)'s lights to the daytime bulbs and couldn't find her when i sprayed the cage because she usually will move around as soon as i spray. she was hanging at the bottom on the cage on a low branch upside down and not moving. I took her out and then put her at the top of the cage and started to mist her. she didn't run away from the mist or move. I was worried she was disoriented because she is shedding and had skin over her eyes but then I put her in warm water and got the skin from around her eyes off. she was really tense and was "pulsing" her grip when I had her on my finger.(1pm) I hold her almost every day for around 30 minutes she is super active and friendly. at 4pm she still had not moved so i went to the store and did the pedialyte soak because i thought it could be dehydration. did the soak at about 6pm and then put her back in the cage making sure all the humidity and temps were right. now its 10 and she is still in the same spot i put her in.
seems to have lost her sense of surroundings, she reaches for things that aren't there and almost fell earlier when i put her back in.

I got karma 3 months ago from LLL reptile and she has been very healthy till now.

cage info
3 100UVB reptisun bulbs
fogger for humidity and then spray bottle for misting
lots of coverage and substrate bottom
feed with crickets and dust with calcium
I feed the crickets the flukers cricket quench that is calcium fortified as well.

bulbs were changed a month ago.

I keep the temp around 85-100 during the day(100 in the basking areas)
humidty at 60-70
90 when misting

I plan on taking her to the vet on monday when they open.
thanks

 

[sharp229]

I'm sorry your chameleon is not doing well. Is this a veiled chameleon? How old? Can you please post pictures?

100F is high, for a female veiled I wouldn't keep the basking temp above 85F. What do you mean by 3 UVB100 bulbs? Do you mean you have three separate bulbs? If so, what is the wattage? You should only need one. Also, there should be no light at night.

However, with a problem this serious all of the sudden, it sounds like something else may be going on. I would really need pictures to have a better idea of the problem, and based on your symptoms I would get her to a vet ASAP.

 

[Pharaoh2015]

Can we get a picture?
And more info on your daily routine
Supplements?
Gut loading?
Feeders?

 

[Pharaoh2015]

Fill out this please.
Here is some recommended information to include when asking for help in the health clinic forum. By providing this information, you will receive more accurate and beneficial responses. It might not be necessary to answer all these questions, but the more you provide the better. Please remember that even the most knowledgeable person can only guess at what your problem may be. Only an experienced reptile veterinarian who can directly examine your animal can give a true diagnosis of your chameleon's health.


Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?
Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.

Cage Info:
Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
Location - Where are you geographically located?

Current Problem - The current problem you are concerned about.

 

[zmyers]

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
About ~2weeks old when I got her online, I have had her for 3 months. I am assuming female because she does not have spurs.
Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
I handle her 5/7 days a week
Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
only crickets, she doesnt seem interested in anything else, I tried mealworms. I dust them with calcium and D3 and feed them the flukers calcium cricket feed. (maybe too much calcium?)
Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?
the calcium and D3 is Reptocal
Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
I mist her 2 times daily and get the humidity to 90. and have a fogger that runs into a dish that collects the water and i make sure to get all the leaves wet.
Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
brown/black droppings, never tested for parasites
History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.
none other than she is shedding at the moment.

Cage Info:
Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
exo terra glass cage 24” x 18” x 24” (WxDxH
exoterra lighting with two
Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
exoterra lighting fixture with two exoterra UVB100 Bulbs which are 26W. at night she has a 40w red light heat bulb. ( i sometimes use this in the day if its cold outside and if the other lamps do not put off enough)
Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
I have a digital thermometer in the middle of the cage and then another in the basking area. I would say 85 at the highest( I typo'ed the first post) in the basking area then the rest >75. at night somewhere from 60-70
Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
i have a humidity guage and i use the fogger to maintain it and then use the mister to spray twice a day. 60 maintained and 90 when sprayed.
Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind? no
Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? at the back of my room away from the door by the window.
At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor? top of the cage is 6 feet off the ground
Location - Where are you geographically located?
Reno Nevada

Current Problem - The current problem you are concerned about.
chameleon not moving and seems to be disoriented.

 

[zmyers]

I'm sorry your chameleon is not doing well. Is this a veiled chameleon? How old? Can you please post pictures?

100F is high, for a female veiled I wouldn't keep the basking temp above 85F. What do you mean by 3 UVB100 bulbs? Do you mean you have three separate bulbs? If so, what is the wattage? You should only need one. Also, there should be no light at night.

However, with a problem this serious all of the sudden, it sounds like something else may be going on. I would really need pictures to have a better idea of the problem, and based on your symptoms I would get her to a vet ASAP.

the 100F was a typo, its more like 85 definitely, and yes 3 seperate bulbs 26W each. they are the curly type not the tube type. Is the red light okay at night? it gets cold here and that is one of the ways I have been keeping her cage warm enough.
I am going to the vet but they are not open till monday so I am trying to do everything I can do myself until then.

 

[Pharaoh2015]

the 100F was a typo, its more like 85 definitely, and yes 3 seperate bulbs 26W each. they are the curly type not the tube type. Is the red light okay at night? it gets cold here and that is one of the ways I have been keeping her cage warm enough.
I am going to the vet but they are not open till monday so I am trying to do everything I can do myself until then.

What the night temp without the bulb?
If it's 60-70 then she doesn't need it and it will likely keep her awake.

Do you use calcium without D3? Or just the one with D3? How often a month?

 

[Pharaoh2015]

The curly uvb bulbs are not as good as the long tube.

 

[zmyers]

The curly uvb bulbs are not as good as the long tube.

just the calcium with D3 in it, and yeah I know the curly ones are not as good, I was gifted all the equipment, enclosure and light fixtures. and everytime I get crickets which is usually every 2 weeks I dust them when i get them. i would think the night temp would be more like 50-60 without the bulb. I can try though.

 

[Pharaoh2015]

Your supplements are off. Should be calcium with D3 2x a month (dust daily)
Calcium without d3 every meal (dust daily) and vitamins 1-2 times a month. When dusting you don't want ghost crickets but lightly covered.

 

[Pharaoh2015]

Is she inside? What do you keep your house/apt at?
It won't change much from your apt and a drop of 10 degrees from regular non basking day temperatures is good for chams.

 

[zmyers]

yeah she is inside, I dont keep my room at a set temp, I live in a house, and just have my own AC unit, I only turn it on if it's over 80 in the room so temp varies probably 70-75. I am going to check the temp tonight but like I said it gets cold here at night, It will probabaly get down to 30 outside and her cage is by the window.

and I will start doing the dusting daily and then what vitamins do you recomend?

 

[Pharaoh2015]

Herptvite I believe is what I use. Have to check when I get back into town tomorrow.

If your apt not getting to 30 I think you can ditch the night bulb.
Yes she by the window but she also getting heat from your AC

 

[zmyers]

anything I can do tomorrow to help, should I do another soak in the pedialyte?

 

[Pharaoh2015]

Idk
Does her eyes stay open throughout the day or is she sleeping?
I'd leave her alone, don't mist her directly, but still mist her cage throughout the day.

 

[sharp229]

She looks pretty healthy in those pictures. Were they taken after she stopped moving?

Her droppings should have a brown part and a white part. Do you see two parts? If the white part is orange, then she may be dehydrated.

You don't need heating at night unless the temp drops below 50F. If it does, you should either keep the room warmer, or use a ceramic heating element (CHE) at night. You don't want light at night so she can sleep well.

I don't see any major issues and am not sure what caused this. I would still make the suggested corrections, but its most likely going to be up to the vet at this point. Does she still keep her eyes open and moving?

Be sure to keep us updated when you do see the vet.

 

[kinyonga]

Some of this has likely been mentioned but its easier just to go over everything than to have to go back to see what was already mentioned.


Its recommended that there should be no lights on the cage at night unless the temperature drops below 60F.

The long linear Repti-sun 5.0 tube light is the most often recommended UVB light. Exposure to UVB light allows the chameleon to produce the D3 it needs to be able to use the calcium in its system. D3 from supplements can build up in the system and lead to health issues but as long as the chameleon can move in and out of the UVB at will there should be no problem with D3 building up from exposure to the UVB.

Since most feeder insects have a poor ratio of calcium to phos. its important to dust with a phos.-free calcium powder at most feedings. The dusting is done just before the insects are fed to the chameleon.

Twice a month its recommended that you dust with a phos.-free calcium/D3 powder to ensure that the chameleon gets some D3 without overdosing it.

Twice a month its recommended that you dust with a vitamin powder that has a beta carotene (prOformed) source of vitamin A. PrOformed sources don't build up in the system like prEformed sources do so this leaves it up to you to decide when/if the chameleon needs some prEformed vitamin A.

Its important to feed/gutload the insects well. Crickets, roaches, locusts, superworms can be fed/gutloaded with a wide assortment of greens such as collards, dandelions, kale, endive, escarole, mustard greens, etc. and veggies such as carrots, sweet red pepper, sweet potato, squash, zucchini, etc.

With proper UVB light, appropriate supplements and feeding/gutloading of the insects and appropriate basking temperatures that will allow the chameleon to digest its food well (thus absorb nutrients well) you have the best chance of your chameleon being healthy.

Substrate is not usually recommended due to the possibility of blockages/impaction.

Don't know that any of this has anything to do with it not moving. Has anything changed in her surroundings that could be scaring her into not moving?
Hope this helps!

 

[zmyers]

She looks pretty healthy in those pictures. Were they taken after she stopped moving?

Her droppings should have a brown part and a white part. Do you see two parts? If the white part is orange, then she may be dehydrated.

You don't need heating at night unless the temp drops below 50F. If it does, you should either keep the room warmer, or use a ceramic heating element (CHE) at night. You don't want light at night so she can sleep well.

I don't see any major issues and am not sure what caused this. I would still make the suggested corrections, but its most likely going to be up to the vet at this point. Does she still keep her eyes open and moving?

Be sure to keep us updated when you do see the vet.

Yeah I took all those pictures yesterday everning, she looks healthy which makes it weIrd that she is acting this way. She seems better this morning, she moved from her other spot and is on some leaves.
I'll post in here when I do go to the vet

 

[zmyers]

Okay so now I am thinking that she may be going blind, which would explain the reason she is reaching for things that are not there. when i take her out she does not want to walk around she just lays down and seems like she closes her eyes.
Is this because of the skin thats around her eyes?
update: I did leave off the red light last night when she was sleeping.

 

[OldChamKeeper]

Zooming in on her eyes, I'd say you have an infection in the one I can see in the picture.

Personally I do not like the CFL's. The first year they came out I picked one up and it put out so much UV my cham had a "sunburn" along his spine. I never bought another and heard others had similar problems back then. No clue about the ones they use today.

Is that cage all glass? Kinda hard to tell from the pictures.

The animal looked dehydrated in some pictures, have you ever put a ficus tree in your shower and put the cham in it for 30 mins with regular water showering the tree? Works wonders if the animal has the strength to climb and hold on to branches.