KeopiCat
Avid Member
Nonetheless, being accustomed to handling is still as much of an achievement as affection is with other animals, so it always makes me happy when my chameleon is okay with me enough to crawl on my arm
Chameleons not making good pets?!! What!?!
- Thread starter Atlas chameleon
- Start date
Nonetheless, being accustomed to handling is still as much of an achievement as affection is with other animals, so it always makes me happy when my chameleon is okay with me enough to crawl on my arm
CandyCham
Member
Oh yesNonetheless, being accustomed to handling is still as much of an achievement as affection is with other animals, so it always makes me happy when my chameleon is okay with me enough to crawl on my arm
We love our chameleons <3 <3
KeopiCat
Avid Member
Oh yes
I'm glad to have found a community that can see these gorgeous animals for what they are.
Also, about cuddling, occasionally when my baby comes out of the shower he crawls from my arm on to my chest... if that's not a chameleon hug, I don't know what is
CandyCham
Member
Certainly if chameleons could hug, that would be it! My girl doesn't like to be handled as much anymore and I'm ok with that. Occasionally she wants to come out and roam though and she has her favorite spotsI'm glad to have found a community that can see these gorgeous animals for what they are.
Also, about cuddling, occasionally when my baby comes out of the shower he crawls from my arm on to my chest... if that's not a chameleon hug, I don't know what is
I admire her and respect her space.I did a interesting experiment on my lady dreamer (the female on the above picture)
I would like to share with u guys,I put a similar size male in her cage ,n whenever the male near her ,she will open her mouth wide n be very defensive and when I took him away,she resume very peaceful towards me,this is the reason that I realize she is seeing another male as a threat but not towards her owner,since I do interact with her n other chameleons every day,I dont cuddle them cause Its unnecessary to hold them in the same position for a long time,I use lots feeder to interact with them,and I dont just put feeder in the cage and walk away,and I dont wrapping the chameleon in a towel,I let them free range on my arm,and these are achieved in a very short period of the time (15min) twice or more in a day every day depending on the chameleons by reading their signs(temp to stay on ur arm or walking away).
I would like to share with u guys,I put a similar size male in her cage ,n whenever the male near her ,she will open her mouth wide n be very defensive and when I took him away,she resume very peaceful towards me,this is the reason that I realize she is seeing another male as a threat but not towards her owner,since I do interact with her n other chameleons every day,I dont cuddle them cause Its unnecessary to hold them in the same position for a long time,I use lots feeder to interact with them,and I dont just put feeder in the cage and walk away,and I dont wrapping the chameleon in a towel,I let them free range on my arm,and these are achieved in a very short period of the time (15min) twice or more in a day every day depending on the chameleons by reading their signs(temp to stay on ur arm or walking away).
Peachypink
Chameleon Enthusiast
This same topic comes around every few months. They learn to tolerate you and want to come out based on the kind of reward or stimuli they get for coming out.....free range time, sun time, just get out of the cage time, etc. They learn that you are not going to eat them and thats about all the affection they have for you. WE are putting our emotion and cute feeling words on them. Are they cute, yes. Do they seem like they want to hang out, sure sometimes. But this is us guessing what they are feeling. Cats and dogs you can tell how they are feeling, they show emotion. But chameleons act on learned responses, if he "likes getting attention before food" then most likely it is that he learned to associate that the behavior equals food.
The problem with us projecting our emotion on them is that then you get beginning keepers looking for the super interactive experience and it is just not something you should go into expecting. No, in general they do not make good pets and if you have a cham that "likes" to snuggle, they are most likely just frozen with fear and stress. We as keepers need to be able to pick up on the subtle behavior changes that indicate stress and illness. We need to recognize when an action is causing them stress, even if it might be super cute. Stress causes internal issues with their immune systems. We need to be just as good at knowing what causes issues we can not see as we are at knowing the obvious external signs. They may "look" like they are not but looks can be deceiving.
The problem with us projecting our emotion on them is that then you get beginning keepers looking for the super interactive experience and it is just not something you should go into expecting. No, in general they do not make good pets and if you have a cham that "likes" to snuggle, they are most likely just frozen with fear and stress. We as keepers need to be able to pick up on the subtle behavior changes that indicate stress and illness. We need to recognize when an action is causing them stress, even if it might be super cute. Stress causes internal issues with their immune systems. We need to be just as good at knowing what causes issues we can not see as we are at knowing the obvious external signs. They may "look" like they are not but looks can be deceiving.
leedragon
Chameleon Enthusiast
Yeah I gonna stop writing in this thread. I am trying to get along with the other members and I sure I would otherwise soon start cursing at people.
In an other note kudos man for breeding as a hobby. I belive it is better that be sure to find homes to the hatchlings than give them away in whole sales.
In an other note kudos man for breeding as a hobby. I belive it is better that be sure to find homes to the hatchlings than give them away in whole sales.
Speak of wholesale me n craigwatt had a long conversation on the phone,he give me his reason and I give him mine,but thats another totally different topic to discuss,I know everyone has their own opinion to believe which is normal since everyone raise in their unique own way,whatever works n believe,I will said keep doing it for sure.
CandyCham
Member
In general, what is a good pet then? Dogs, cats, fish, horses? They all require knowledge and good care to be a good pet... same with chameleons.
Atlas chameleon
Member
I agree
Matt Vanilla Gorilla
Chameleon Enthusiast
I want to thank every one for the measure of kindness and respect we all show each other despite for not agreeing on everything! The most important part is that we are there to help each other when in need and the fact that we all love our chameleons! I love our forum and thank you all for your valuable contributions!
Peachypink
Chameleon Enthusiast
I think that just depends on your definition of what "good pet" means and for who. Would I get my 5 year old a Cham, no. A puppy, yes. I place Cham keeping in a more specialized field. Same with horses. I wouldn't just go out and buy a horse even though I want one. It takes knowledge, equipment and space I just don't have.
Atlas chameleon
Member
That's true
CandyCham
Member
Ahh, see I just wouldn't get a 5 year old a pet. People truly forget the demanding, consistent training required for a puppy along with the breed factor. Any pet needs knowledge and the right care. I just don't want to confuse general with common. Of course, getting a 5 year old a pet... Who is really doing all the work and guidance hehe.
Whatascene
Member
Welp, you've just opened the can of worms where the two opposing schools of thought with raising chameleons are coming out. They are:
1. Minimal handlers- Fact is, due to capability of brain and whatnot- chameleons really aren't affectionate. It's true, they tolerate us. In a sense, that's the closest to love and affection you'll get, is the respect of tolerating you. This school of thought typically leans towards conservatively handling chams to minimize stress and vulnerability to stressful illnesses that can arise. These folks follow the, they are pets to observe, not handle.
2. Regular handlers- Handle chameleons regularly to keep them socialized. This school of thought assumes that regular handling will equate less stress ultimately when the owner has unavoidable contact, like: to make cage adjustments, take them out for shower or other treatments, take them to the vet, or any other inevitable situations with cham ownership. There can also be the idea of, might as well enjoy my pet and having not a strong belief the handling will harm the cham's long-term health.
I personally fall closer to the #2 realm, as I've found handling chams regularly does socialize them in a way that makes a lot of chameleon care soooo much easier. When I take them to the vet or have to administer drops- soooo much easier when your cham is used to your hands. They tend to be less aggressive and I enjoy my time with them! I do agree with some aspects of #1, as they are not soley for the entertainment of the owner. I think of raising chameleons as like a hobby- like growing difficult roses. Raising them takes a lot of dedication and effort as chameleons can get sick and die too easily.
1. Minimal handlers- Fact is, due to capability of brain and whatnot- chameleons really aren't affectionate. It's true, they tolerate us. In a sense, that's the closest to love and affection you'll get, is the respect of tolerating you. This school of thought typically leans towards conservatively handling chams to minimize stress and vulnerability to stressful illnesses that can arise. These folks follow the, they are pets to observe, not handle.
2. Regular handlers- Handle chameleons regularly to keep them socialized. This school of thought assumes that regular handling will equate less stress ultimately when the owner has unavoidable contact, like: to make cage adjustments, take them out for shower or other treatments, take them to the vet, or any other inevitable situations with cham ownership. There can also be the idea of, might as well enjoy my pet and having not a strong belief the handling will harm the cham's long-term health.
I personally fall closer to the #2 realm, as I've found handling chams regularly does socialize them in a way that makes a lot of chameleon care soooo much easier. When I take them to the vet or have to administer drops- soooo much easier when your cham is used to your hands. They tend to be less aggressive and I enjoy my time with them! I do agree with some aspects of #1, as they are not soley for the entertainment of the owner. I think of raising chameleons as like a hobby- like growing difficult roses. Raising them takes a lot of dedication and effort as chameleons can get sick and die too easily.
CandyCham
Member
I handle mine enough to minimize stress for daily care and whatnot but not so much as to bother her needlessly for my own enjoyment either. But this is about them being "good" pets I think? And I am a strong believer that a good pet is a thriving pet. This can't be done without a knowledgable owner and the right care . Ofcourse, the owner would have to enjoy the pet and that should in itself harbor knowledge and care (I'd hope! - I know not every person takes care of their pets
)Tiger and lion living in the wild are very vicious animals,some people raise the tiger or the lion cub with all their love n caring,they became very tame with their human owner,anything is possible in this world,it all depends on how much "Time" u put in,especially raising them when they were tiny babies,I love all my chameleons,and I interact with them endless time like a mother caring for their babies,I hand feed some of them(at one time was way too many ,feel like a nusery school ) I was their survival kit,their life depending on me,I sacrifice all my time in my chameleon room and watch them ,make sure there is no poops in any where in the cage,along with every day bugs cleaning routine,when I found people that wants the baby,I pass on my knowledge how I care for the babies to the next,when these babies part it away from my home,I felt like a father n a mother saying goodbye to their babies even though they not a baby no more,its like saying good bye when they going away to the college n continue to their next destination.
U might think I can be over board on these babies n all my other pets,but watch them growing its a whole lot of memory that it cant be replace!!!
Time and patience are on my side at this moment,I am committed to my babies and in return they are tamed n healthy.
All these sacrifice can bring what I want~~~~~~my Happiness which is irreplaceable
U might think I can be over board on these babies n all my other pets,but watch them growing its a whole lot of memory that it cant be replace!!!
Time and patience are on my side at this moment,I am committed to my babies and in return they are tamed n healthy.
All these sacrifice can bring what I want~~~~~~my Happiness which is irreplaceable
CharlieCharmingo
Avid Member
I'm going to be honest and say right here that I only read most of the comments. I agree with some things: Like not all chameleons are the Netflix and chill type and that if they show signs of wanting to be just a display animal then that's what you should let them be. I also agree that they are not like most pets and you can't play catch or wrap them in blankets etc. However if you get them young like @Matt Vanilla Gorilla said and handle them but with patience and understanding of actually trying to gage how you are affecting them and knowing what's best for your chameleon they can be handled and "like it" . Tony rushes to his cage when he sees me, crawls around me for a bit before he gets down and does his own thing. He's not afraid of me at all (unless I drink a large glass of tea in a class cup (the color freaks him out) or a chicken sand which with ranch (yea I don't know about that one either)). However I will say I let him get used to me at his own will and let him know that he could be on me or out on his own and nothing would harm him. Here's some picks of him with me not stressed or puffed. I think honestly the care of the chameleon depends on the owner AND the chameleon and how each views the other. Still I also agree that there's more wanting nothing to do with you chameleons then there are friendly ones. I'm not trying to pick fights or anything just voicing my opinion.
Carlton
Chameleon Enthusiast
We can debate this forever, but to me, the most important thing to remember is, what is the most humane and responsible approach to sharing your home with this animal. IMHO, first it is the owner's responsibility to understand and respect what your cham is telling you. You need to educate yourself about their behavior and what motivates them. So much of their behavior is genetically hard-wired, not voluntary. They behave the way they do because of their evolutionary background. There is only so much you can do to override that. YOU need to be the accurate observer. Do you truly interpret the cham's behavior correctly and without anthropomorphizing? Misinterpreting what your cham is trying so hard to communicate, you can end up with a sick or dying creature. No one wants this. If you find yourself trying to ignore your cham's behavior so you can have the pet you wanted, the little guy will suffer for it. Then it won't matter whether you regard a cham as a pet, a hobby, a display creature or not. You will have a miserable cham.
Let your individual chameleon teach you what it can handle....regardless of species, cbb or wc, a so-called "pet" or not, what you expected out of the one you bought, what you ended up getting, the bottom line is that chams are individuals and need to be respected that way. You can't force them to be something they are not. You can teach them what to expect from you and from your household, but don't expect or demand that they conform to what you want. It isn't going to happen.
Let your individual chameleon teach you what it can handle....regardless of species, cbb or wc, a so-called "pet" or not, what you expected out of the one you bought, what you ended up getting, the bottom line is that chams are individuals and need to be respected that way. You can't force them to be something they are not. You can teach them what to expect from you and from your household, but don't expect or demand that they conform to what you want. It isn't going to happen.
