Deciding on a chameleon

[ataraxia]

i did just skim that thread. forgive my lack of attention to read that through. it is suggested for pygmy chameleons from what little i read... now for glass keeping....no way do i think im even qualified to raise a arboreal chameleon in glass. i personally think its a ticking time bomb unless you follow advice from others that keep "SAME SPECIES IN SAME SIZE TANK". temps imo would be so hard to keep = as the seasons change and your ambient air temps are being cooled or heated. fans on or off. near direct sunlight. near opening/closing doors inside or outside. just ambient flux with temps i think would possibly throw dangers if glass cage is not kept in a room that is monitored properly.

in a large screen cage. i have a jacksons. his basking is around 78-79 normally with my ambient room temps around 72-73. now the last few days we had some pretty warm weather and the temp in the room got to 77. that 5 degree temp change in the room made him gape while basking. in a glass cage we could have had major issues if i didnt catch that in time.

 

[Jjreeb]

ignorance at its finest

i did just skim that thread. forgive my lack of attention to read that through. it is suggested for pygmy chameleons from what little i read... now for glass keeping....no way do i think im even qualified to raise a arboreal chameleon in glass. i personally think its a ticking time bomb unless you follow advice from others that keep "SAME SPECIES IN SAME SIZE TANK". temps imo would be so hard to keep = as the seasons change and your ambient air temps are being cooled or heated. fans on or off. near direct sunlight. near opening/closing doors inside or outside. just ambient flux with temps i think would possibly throw dangers if glass cage is not kept in a room that is monitored properly.

in a large screen cage. i have a jacksons. his basking is around 78-79 normally with my ambient room temps around 72-73. now the last few days we had some pretty warm weather and the temp in the room got to 77. that 5 degree temp change in the room made him gape while basking. in a glass cage we could have had major issues if i didnt catch that in time.

well if you had actually read that thred it may have addressed your concerns. sometimes it really bugs me, the ignorance of some people on this forum. most of you are extremely helpfull and for you guys, i do really appreciate it

 

[robmd1]

well if you had actually read that thred it may have addressed your concerns. sometimes it really bugs me, the ignorance of some people on this forum. most of you are extremely helpfull and for you guys, i do really appreciate it

how rudethe only one im seein bein ignorant is you, you come on here an say youve done research but its clear you didnt, people give you advise cause weve either been there or have done our research, im done readin this useless thread get an do whatever you want, im sure when you have problems, those same people that tried to help you now wont be so happy to help in then when you disregaurded all they hadt to say to begin with..
know it all newbies.. good luck to you

 

[ataraxia]

its no biggie. i just hope he gets correct advice he will agree on.

good luck!

 

[Jjreeb]

its no biggie. i just hope he gets correct advice he will agree on.

good luck!

thank you ataraxia, and sorry for my remark, i misread your post, and for whatever reason saw it as slightly hostile? doesnt make sense, but thats the way i saw it.... again my apologies, i didnt mean to sound so rude.

 

[Chris Anderson]

Sorry I missed this thread for so long, hopefully I can help by adding my thoughts.

I've never understood or agreed with the notion that glass terrariums are only appropriate enclosures in certain parts of the world. In my opinion they can be used very effectively in more places than they can't. Few of us live anywhere that we can keep all of our chameleons, particularly montane species, outdoors year round, thereby forcing us to maintain them indoors under artificial climate control of one type of another. If you live up north, the cold winters make maintaining humidity complicated making glass terraiums great to fix that. In the south, the air conditioning we use to keep the house cool dries the air, also making glass terrariums ideal. If you're keeping your chameleons indoors, there is a good chance glass terrariums can be used very effectively if done correctly.

I typically do not recommend glass terrariums for larger species except for raising younger animals and possibly females. That said, Exo-Terra is now producing a 36"x18"x36" terrarium which in my opinion could house an adult male veiled or panther provided it was not an individual who roams a lot. Ultimately it will depend on the individual but this sized enclosure would be completely suitable for many individuals. That said, I would not recommend the 36"x18"x24" for an adult veiled or panther.

For the 36"x18"x24" terrarium, I would recommend a single individual of the smaller true chameleon species (jacksonii, multituberculatum, sternfeldi, etc.). While some of the smaller of these species might do well as a pair in a cage this size, attempting to do so is definitely an advanced care technique that I would not recommend to the OP having never kept chameleons before, particularly these species. One thing to consider, however, is that many of these species are primarily available as WC and acclimating a WC chameleon in glass terrariums is more difficult because you are limited in the amount of watering you are able to provide. Thus, I would recommend making sure to get a well started CB specimen and as a first chameleon, I would recommend either a CB jacksonii or sternfeldi if you were going to go with a smaller montane.

Similarly, I would not recommend cohabitating other herps with your chameleons in this enclosure, particularly as a new keeper. There are too many factors which you simply can't read about to be prepared for that go into this type of attempt. I am about to start setting up a 36"x18"x24" Exo Terra glass terrarium with a group of pygmy chameleons and williams blue day geckos, but these are very small species for an enclosure of this size, they are of approximately the same size, they naturally live in the same habitat, and I have a lot of experience to watch for problems. It isn't something I would recommend a newer keeper ever attempting, however.

As has been mentioned, lose the waterfall. They are breeding grounds for bacteria so unless you are going to completely disinfect it every other day, I don't think they are worth it.

Just to reiterate, these few links should be helpful:
https://www.chameleonforums.com/everyone-who-knows-you-cant-keep-chameleons-glass-31937/
http://www.chameleonnews.com/10JulAndersonGlass.html
http://www.chameleonnews.com/10JulManchen.html

Chris

 

[Julirs]

I think that people should understand that caging is very dependent on the climate-with climate also meaning "inside the house". If you do not have air conditioning, and it gets hot where you live, glass cages are not going to work.

I know that Chris just basically said this very thing, but I am suprised at the number of people in warm climates that do not have air conditioning that are members of this forum.

We Florida people are very lucky with temps that stay fairly consistent.

 

[Chris Anderson]

I think that people should understand that caging is very dependent on the climate-with climate also meaning "inside the house". If you do not have air conditioning, and it gets hot where you live, glass cages are not going to work.

I know that Chris just basically said this very thing, but I am suprised at the number of people in warm climates that do not have air conditioning that are members of this forum.

We Florida people are very lucky with temps that stay fairly consistent.

True, I was assuming that if you are keeping a chameleon that in one way or another you are able to provide appropriate temperatures for it (either in the house or out). Obviously if you don't have air conditioning in your house and temps are high, you shouldn't be keeping montane species in the first place and the species you are keeping are going to be limited to those that can tolerate the temps (typically larger species which you wouldn't keep in most terrariums anyway). More than anything, I was simply indicating that there isn't any type of geographic line that indicates where you can or can't use different types of enclosures.

Chris

 

[cityman212]

Just a few words... Listen to the others. Waterfalls, glass enclosures and great misting systems all together will lead to nothing but problems with your cham. I thought the same thing as you have explained and learned the hard way. When they get sick they go quick... Start out with the proper setup, if your dead set on the one you have explained I would suggest something like a Chineese Water Dragon, great pets, great personalities much more tollerant of your setup.

 

[Texas Ranger]

From one of your last few post. Its seems to me like you are wanting a reptile zoo with no walls. (chameleons with frogs, geckos, other chameleons.) What exactly do you want? Its so scatterd around. I honestly dont think you know what you want. You just WANT. No matter what it is. And that would be impulse buying.
By any chance did you see the movie "Rango"?

 

[Julirs]

True, I was assuming that if you are keeping a chameleon that in one way or another you are able to provide appropriate temperatures for it (either in the house or out). Obviously if you don't have air conditioning in your house and temps are high, you shouldn't be keeping montane species in the first place and the species you are keeping are going to be limited to those that can tolerate the temps (typically larger species which you wouldn't keep in most terrariums anyway). More than anything, I was simply indicating that there isn't any type of geographic line that indicates where you can or can't use different types of enclosures.

Chris

I wish we could assume these things. The OP is talking about needing to cool the glass tank in order to house a chameleon that would "work" size wise in the Exoterra tank that he wants to use.

 

[Jjreeb]

This is the cage that has been offered to me, for a better price then even a basic screen set-up, so this is the enclosure I will be buying today. I will lose the waterfall. I don't see the problem with the misting system if I'm cleaning regularly and have some sort of drainage system. As for the question about the geckos, that was a simple curiosity because I've seen it done before. I am very excited to get my chameleon and will do much more research yet. If any one has any carpet chams or jacksons who will ship to Canada, it would be great to hear from you.

Thanks so much guys

 

[Jjreeb]

I wish we could assume these things. The OP is talking about needing to cool the glass tank in order to house a chameleon that would "work" size wise in the Exoterra tank that he wants to use.

I live in Edmonton Alberta, it rarely gets warmer outside then inside. The few days that it would be to warm( fewer then 10 a year) I considered getting a mini a/c or blowing a fan across it, what do you guys think?

 

[daveo]

By any chance did you see the movie "Rango"?

That made me giggle

 

[Texas Ranger]

That made me giggle

Oh then. You must have got it

 

[kinyonga]

Jjreeb said..."I know the glass is lessthen ideal but it it not ALL glass. It has front and top ventilation, as I've said I will have a small fan running. I HAVE done hours of research. There are many cases in whichpeople use these terrariums with a fan running"...if you place the basking light in one corner of the cage or to one side of the top of the cage you will create air flow by creating a chimney affect. I've done this for years...and have never had to use a fan. I live in S. Ontario, BTW...to give you an idea of the climate here.

 

[Jjreeb]

Even easier! Thx kimyonga

 

[melric]

I wanna know how many of you have actually used a exo terra terrarium or are just parroting glass=bad. I keep all my baby chams in exo's and as they get older I'm moving them to screen. I've never had a problem yet and have read all the warnings everyone posts. Why are you all so hostile to glass without having the experience?
As for the waterfalls I don't use one based on the forum discussions, but have yet to find any info on chams dying from them. Jmo don't go out and get one, because they truly are just for decoration.