justjumpit621
New Member
I have heard people say to go somewhere where they do not care for the grass (no pesticides) and to keep them and fed them for a few days to get anything out of their system.
Feeding pinky mice?
- Thread starter dtown
- Start date
I have heard people say to go somewhere where they do not care for the grass (no pesticides) and to keep them and fed them for a few days to get anything out of their system.
FFSTRescue
New Member
I keep seeing people say they have kept chameleons for many years, even decades, without feeding pinkie mice, and therefore they are not needed because they were never given and seemed to do fine, but has anyone on here kept chameleons that long and given them pinkie mice weekly, monthly, bi-annually, and had them thrive without shortened life-span or showing signs of fatty liver disease, etc? I would like to hear comments from those people, as that would be the best thing to compare. 
draetish
Avid Member
I keep seeing people say they have kept chameleons for many years, even decades, without feeding pinkie mice, and therefore they are not needed because they were never given and seemed to do fine, but has anyone on here kept chameleons that long and given them pinkie mice weekly, monthly, bi-annually, and had them thrive without shortened life-span or showing signs of fatty liver disease, etc? I would like to hear comments from those people, as that would be the best thing to compare.
I don't think you will find alot of people, if any that have done this. The main reason is the amount of protein in the mice and we know that leads to gout possibly. I don't think it is natural for the smaller species and I'm sure the larger chams in the wild don't do it on a daily basis. Think about it, mice don't live in trees and if they do run across an occassional bird nest with a chick and no parent around, then it's free food.
FFSTRescue
New Member
I asked if there is anyone here who feed pinkie mice to their chameleons, obviously the larger chameleons, because of size of the prey, weekly, monthly, bi-annually (twice yearly), etc (not "on a daily basis"), and noted any concerns, because I don't feed anything but insects, so it would be interesting to find out, though at this point, I think people are afraid to say they have . Feeding a pinkie mouse twice a year wouldn't cause gout, mealworms have a higher crude protein content than pinkie, but pinkies are very high in crude fat content, which I could see would cause hepatic lipidosis if given in high frequency. Also, is there anyone on here who has done field research and actually monitored what a chameleon ingests in the wild in a day? That would be very interesting information. None of the chameleons I have treated that had significant problems, including gout, were fed pinkie mice, so, if there is that one person out there who has done so, please let us know
. Feeding a pinkie mouse twice a year wouldn't cause gout, mealworms have a higher crude protein content than pinkie, but pinkies are very high in crude fat content, which I could see would cause hepatic lipidosis if given in high frequency. Also, is there anyone on here who has done field research and actually monitored what a chameleon ingests in the wild in a day? That would be very interesting information. None of the chameleons I have treated that had significant problems, including gout, were fed pinkie mice, so, if there is that one person out there who has done so, please let us know 
OldSkoolxReasons
New Member
I've fed mice to my panthers once or twice. But they were hoppers. They offer alot more nutritional value than pinkies as they have calcified bones and such. Pinkies are fat blobs and way high in protein. feeding them too often could theoretically cause gout. I only have two chams that will readily accept hoppers anyways. Both are females and they have both been given them twice(both occasions for both females were during or after being gravid). Everyone else looked at me like "WTF!?!? You really want me to eat something that has hair and not antennae?"
Justin
Justin
SliK JiM
New Member
I haven't kept chameleons for that long, but my feelings are the same. It's unnecessary to do so, so unless someone happens to give me one (who knows why they would) I shan't actively look to feed mine mice.
sandrachameleon
Chameleon Enthusiast
Would depend why it was skinny. But yes larva are an option.
You may find this webpage interesting: http://www.chameleonnews.com/?page=article&id=92
FFSTRescue
New Member
Thank you Sandrachameleon for that article, it was a great read and I think everyone should definitely read it!
To sum up: it is written by a veterinarian and talks about what prey should be given and when. For example, when fat is needed in the diet, and when protein is needed. Gravid females need a high amount of protein for albumin production, but a balance needs to be made of about 40/60 % fat/protein.
To sum up: it is written by a veterinarian and talks about what prey should be given and when. For example, when fat is needed in the diet, and when protein is needed. Gravid females need a high amount of protein for albumin production, but a balance needs to be made of about 40/60 % fat/protein.
Digby Rigby
Member
When it comes to using mammals as feeders the nutrional value comes from the skeleton and organs. Therefore weaned animals are the way to go. When we have had need for smaller feeders we have used pygmy mice. 8 adults weigh an ounce. In regards to the comment made about skulls causing impaction. We have never heard or sewen it. In snakes for instance and other reptiles that eat even large vertebrates, it is the hair or feathers that dont digest, not the skeletons. If fed appropriately sized animals and the ones being fed are healthy and physiologically ready to eat with proper basking temperatures, impaction is a non issue.
Worms such as nightcrawlers and earthworms are excellent sources of calcium and protein as are grasshoppers, locusts, and snails. More important than the amount of nutrients is the ratio such as a ratio of at least 2 parts calcium to 1 part phosphorous.
Silkworms and hornworms are far superior than wax worms also for adding bulk.
Worms such as nightcrawlers and earthworms are excellent sources of calcium and protein as are grasshoppers, locusts, and snails. More important than the amount of nutrients is the ratio such as a ratio of at least 2 parts calcium to 1 part phosphorous.
Silkworms and hornworms are far superior than wax worms also for adding bulk.
draetish
Avid Member
I know this is off subject but regarding nightcrawlers, earthworms and snails and the concern of parasites. Are you talking about wild caught and if so what is your take on the parasite issue?
Digby Rigby
Member
Do you use wild caught feeders?
My post stands and you are correct it was off topic as far as your reply to my post. It has also been discussed here many times and my stance is use the healthiest safest sources.
If a post is not related to the topic I do not usually answer any off topic questions can be directed to me via email [email protected]
Digby Rigby
My post stands and you are correct it was off topic as far as your reply to my post. It has also been discussed here many times and my stance is use the healthiest safest sources.
If a post is not related to the topic I do not usually answer any off topic questions can be directed to me via email [email protected]
Digby Rigby
draetish
Avid Member
Really sorry to be blunt, but I don't really see the need for this rude response. Forget I asked the question. However you were the one that brought up nightcrawlers, earthworms, snails, etc.
FFSTRescue
New Member
??? That was an odd response.
dtown
New Member
Thank you for everyones response!?!? There is definately some informative material that came out of this thread.
Chamero
New Member
This is not from experience, but I have seen this argued about for a while.
No one seems to have any stories of negative affects and
no one can offer any evidence of why it is bad, just that its not natural or not good on a regular basis.
My conclusion from this is that its ok for a one time or twice a year thing.
I will be feeding my veiled one when he gets older.
No one seems to have any stories of negative affects and
no one can offer any evidence of why it is bad, just that its not natural or not good on a regular basis.
My conclusion from this is that its ok for a one time or twice a year thing.
I will be feeding my veiled one when he gets older.
sandrachameleon
Chameleon Enthusiast
One of the reasons pinkies are not good on a regular basis is Gout. Do a little more reading and you'll find the evidence.
What I've found harder to find is any evidence offering them at all, like even twice a year, provides any benefit.
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