Female veiled eating sand in the laying bin

[Krowbar N' Slide]

Ok guys, I know this has been covered a few times but I have yet to see a Thread that covers exactly what's going on in my situation so I felt like this was warranted.

I have 2 veiled chams, Krowbar (F) and Slide (M). I plan on mating them when they get old enough but Slide is still a baby (3 months?). Krowbar is approx. 6 months old and she's very healthy.

I keep Krowbar in a 24x24x48 wire cage with plastic on three sides to keep in the humidity, 85 degrees in the basking spot down to as cool as 65 in the winter. I have a uvb 5.0 bulb and 100 watt heat lamp on both cages set on 12 hr intervals for day/night. I feed mainly crickets (home bred), with an assortment of worms ranging from mealworms to hornworms occasionally.

I have a crane penguin fogger that I plumbed using pvc to both cages which serves to add humidity and also water them, she has primarily fake vines and foliage but also a 20" tall pothos plant to catch the extra water from the fogger. I have yet to see her eat any leaves from the pothos.

Now for the meat and potatoes of this post. Krowbar is an absolute B!t@h. She always has been since the day I got her. She hisses at you if you get within 6 inches of her and bites if you get closer. I have never abused her or even just grabbed her. The only way I can get her out of her cage is by using a plastic plant I have and shooing her onto it amidst hisses and hateful glares. Once she's out of her cage I can eventually get her to climb onto my hand but any other hand (including mine) will get hissed at or bit.

I have been worried about the egg laying process for a while so I have been putting a bowl of sand into her cage for a test lay bin but I always take it back out soon after due to her shooting her tongue at it and eating the sand. Well today I put the sand bowl back in and she immediately started climbing down to get to it so for a change I picked it up and she climbed right out onto my arm to get to it. Not a hiss or a strike. Just calm as could be.

Well needless to say, I was beyond shocked. So I let her climb in the bowl and continue to eat the sand. I put the bowl back into the cage and she turned a color I hadn't seen before (pictured) definitely happy to eat sand... eventually after about 10 minutes of eating sand she climbed back out of the bowl and back to the top of her cage. She then went back to being her old B!t@hy self. Btw she never tried to scratch or dig the sand so I'm assuming she's not pregnant.

I'm sorry for such a long post but hopefully you guys can give me some insight, shes the first Cham I've ever owned and I've only had her since Black Friday.

P.s. The other picture is showing her normal unhappy colors when I put my hand in her cage.

Thanks a bunch for any help guys!

 

[kinyonga]

What supplements do you use and how often for each and what do you feed/gutload the insects? Please be SPECIFIC.

 

[Krowbar N' Slide]

What supplements do you use and how often for each and what do you feed/gutload the insects? Please be SPECIFIC.

I use flukers orange cubes and flukers dry high calcium cricket food and dust the crickets with calcium (no d3).
Probably once a month I use a multi vitamin powder to dust the crickets with

 

[Kristen Wilkins]

I use flukers orange cubes and flukers dry high calcium cricket food and dust the crickets with calcium (no d3).
Probably once a month I use a multi vitamin powder to dust the crickets with

Hi there you need a better gut load for your creckets . Will you be going with a bigger lay bin ? You wrote that's ones just a test bin ?

 

[Andee]

This is your problem. Your gutloading is terrible, and so is your dusting. She feels she needs minerals. She also definitely looks gravid to me. Doesn't look ready to lay, but yeah. Your gutload should be full of healthy fruits and veggies as the water source and then a better dry gutload, my preferce is to use a combination of three commercially available ones or do as I do and make my own. Your supplementing should be the plain calcium every feeding, but you should also be doing some sort of d3 and multivitamin source. I don't really care how she gets it. I do something not so common and do an all in one.

 

[kinyonga]

I feed/gutload the crickets, roaches, superworms with a wide assortment of greens, veggies such as dandelion greens, collards, kale, endive, carrots, sweet red pepper, sweet potato, squash, zucchini, etc and a bit of fruit such as Apple, pear, melon, berries.

Since most feeder insects have a poor ratio of calcium to phosphorous it's recommended that you dust the insects just before feeding them to the chameleon with a phosphorous-free calcium powder to make up for it.

A proper UVB light to allow the chameleon to produce D3 so that it can use the calcium in its system. Since it's not certain that a chameleon gets enough from the UVB lights used we recommend dusting twice a month with a phosphorous-free calcium/D3 powder to ensure it gets it without overdosing it. D3 from supplements can build up in the system and lead to MBD so we only do it twice a month and leave the chameleon to get the rest from the UVB light. As long as the chameleon can move in and out of the UVB at will it won't produce too much D3 from the light.

I also recommend dusting twice a month with a vitamin powder that contains a beta carotene (prOformed source) form of vitamin A. Vitamin A from prEformed sources build up in the system and lead to health issues...so by using this type of vitamin powder it leaves it up to us to decide if/when the chameleon needs it. There is controversy as to whether all/any chameleon s can convert the beta carotene.

Is the sand passing through her?

Hope this helps.

 

[Krowbar N' Slide]

So when I started raising my own crickets I was feeding them a lot of different veggies but it seemed like 75-80% of it was going to waste and drying out so I stopped using them, the multivitamin I mentioned is reptivite, could I just use that more often to supplement the veggies?

yes when she starts to dig in the sand my plan is to move her to a trash can with moist sand in it and a heat lamp so she can do her thing and then move her back when she's done. When you say she's definitely gravid are you referring to her colors? Because she only looks like that when I invade her space

 

[Krowbar N' Slide]

Also I just realized it looks like I said I dust the crickets with calcium once a month....I dust them with calc every time I feed and reptivite multivitamin once a month

 

[Dragon1516]

First of all do not let her eat the sand it can kill her. Second there is no way she is pregnant if she is only 6 months old don't breed her until she is at least a year old. I would gut load way better than you are cause she is eating the sand cause she isn't getting the nutrition and take out the laying bin she is only6 months old. Is the calcium with D3? And no she is not pregnant take the bin out. And you need the veggies and a good gut load for your insects and don't only feed them crickets mix it up.

 

[Lizzie The Chameleon]

First of all do not let her eat the sand it can kill her. Second there is no way she is pregnant if she is only 6 months old don't breed her until she is at least a year old. I would gut load way better than you are cause she is eating the sand cause she isn't getting the nutrition and take out the laying bin she is only6 months old. Is the calcium with D3? And no she is not pregnant take the bin out. And you need the veggies and a good gut load for your insects and don't only feed them crickets mix it up.

no the statement about chameleons not being able to be gravid at 6 months is not true by a long shot. females can become gravid with or without ever even seeing a male at the age of 4 months and up. they shouldn't be MATED until at least a year old, but she very well could be gravid at 6 months of age. it is important to always be prepared and always have a laying bin available as early as 4 months of age. she looks gravid to my novice eye, definitely keep the bin in there.

 

[kinyonga]

Orange cubes are not good to use. If the Reptivite has preformed vitamin A in it be careful not tomover use it.
I change the greens and veggies for the insects every second day. Do not take the egglaying bin out. The problem of eating the sand has to be addressed but having a place to lay eggs is important.

Is the sand passing through her??????

 

[Krowbar N' Slide]

I honestly don't know if the sand is passing through her yet, yesterday was the first day I left the bin in her cage. I blended up a bunch of oranges, bananas, green beans, bell pepper, and lettuce and froze them in ice cubes for later use. Seems like the crickets like it...you think that'll help?

 

[Krowbar N' Slide]

I kinda wish I never got a female, there's no concrete way to know if she's gravid or not....I'm really getting tired of worrying about her

 

[Kristen Wilkins]

I kinda wish I never got a female, there's no concrete way to know if she's gravid or not....I'm really getting tired of worrying about her

Good evening you may want to go a head and change over her bin , she absolutely can lay at 6 months keep her bin set up . If there's no male they won't be fertile . Your gut load should be more greens dandelion , kale ,Swiss chard , carrot greens , carrots , sweet potato , red bell pepper , raspberries if your making it . I add the calcium with out D3 . If you don't want to make it then look into repashy . You can order it on line . Once you get her on a balanced diet full of minerals and vitamins , her correct calcium she should stop eating sand . If you can get some hornworms or silkworms that will help passing the sand . We worry it's human . Instinctually with her correct set up she will do what she needs to do likely .

 

[Pitcard]

I kinda wish I never got a female, there's no concrete way to know if she's gravid or not....I'm really getting tired of worrying about her

Worrying leads to learning, hopefully! Don't get down on her, females take a bit of work and time, especially your first.

A good way to tell is to get a scale and weigh her often. Get a feel for how much she's growing in how much time. Any rapid weight would suggest eggs, and once she's full grown it's almost a guaranteed method.

 

[Krowbar N' Slide]

I can't see her being low on calcium, I literally dust her food ever time I feed her, twice a day. Could it be a different vitamin/mineral she's missing?

 

[Kristen Wilkins]

I can't see her being low on calcium, I literally dust her food ever time I feed her, twice a day. Could it be a different vitamin/mineral she's missing?

possible but @Nursemaia , @Remkon or @Matt Vanilla Gorilla i think could give you a much better answer to that then I . See if any of them will chim in .

 

[alphakenc]

Are u absolutely positively she is eating the sand?what is her poop look like??
Btw,the container of the sand is too shallow for her to lay her eggs in,get something deeper like a 5 gallon buckets at least.

 

[Krowbar N' Slide]

She started by shooting her tongue at the sand then when she got in the bowl she began biting it, I can say I never saw her get a mouthful of sand but it definitely looked like she was eating some. And the bowl is only so I can see when she starts digging, then I will put in something bigger

 

[Kristen Wilkins]

She started by shooting her tongue at the sand then when she got in the bowl she began biting it, I can say I never saw her get a mouthful of sand but it definitely looked like she was eating some. And the bowl is only so I can see when she starts digging, then I will put in something bigger

There was not creckets in there did you see her do it more then once ?