Help! Vet can't see her until tomorrow!

[Winnie5761]

MJ is not herself and I'm fearing upper respiratory infection.

Her coloring just seamed "off" all afternoon. I only saw her eat one cricket today. She did drink once, but her eyes are looking a little sunken and she's gaping.

I finally found a vet 45 min away that sees reptiles, but they can't see her till 10am tomorrow!

What can I do to keep my little great-grandcham alive till then?!

Please help!

 

[Gloriawood]

Deep breath! Can we see a photo of her now?

Some chams are shy eaters and drinkers, and gaping can be from a number of things. They will gape to cool down and help loosen shed.

It’s possible she could have a shed coming on. Some chams appetite will reduce right before they shed. This could also alter her coloring.

Has she shown any other signs of RI? Nose pointed up, stringy or thick saliva, poping or wheezing noises?

What are her enclosure temps at?

IF it is an RI, from what you are saying I would not think it’s far along.

Remember we are not vets, and can only provide advice from our own experience.

 

[Winnie5761]

It’s possible she could have a shed coming on.

She shed about a week ago. How often do they shed?

Has she shown any other signs of RI? Nose pointed up, stringy or thick saliva, poping or wheezing noises?

She's been hanging vertically today. I have noticed her throwing her head back a few times with open mouth. My youngest daughter noticed a bubble in one of her nostrils. That's when I started searching for a vet. No saliva, no noises.

What are her enclosure temps at?

I try to keep humidity between 30-50% during the day and above 80% at night.
Her enclosure is normally around 75⁰ with her basking at 80⁰. However when I took these pics to double check, my thermometer had corroded so my husband in buying a new one as I write this.

Can we see a photo of her now?

Remember we are not vets, and can only provide advice from our own experience.

I do understand that, but you all have much more experience than I. I was the one who called the adjoining pet store to please come get the ghecko that I covered with a box. I found him/her when I opened the beauty supply store where I worked. Now I'm heartbroken that there could possibly be something wrong my poor little baby!

 

[GrannyK]

Oh Grammy sorry she’s going through this! I think you having the appointment tomorrow morning is best you can do and personally I think if you just began to notice these symptoms today and you have an appointment tomorrow, you may have caught it early enough she will be ok until then.

She would not be shedding again, usually 3-5 weeks in between when little.

Humidity on veiled for day I believe is better close 30-40% but your night seems good at 80.

Good luck

 

[Gloriawood]

No saliva no noises is a great sign. If it is an RI, I really think you caught it early and she will be fine through the night. The bubble on her nose is odd.

Her temps are cooler at night when the humidity is up correct?

Little ones shed pretty often as they are growing and it slows down with age.

I’ll let some more experienced keepers chime in with any advice, but I think the vet visit isn’t a bad idea. Just try and stay calm. I’ve seen much much more worrying situations turn out just fine.

 

[Winnie5761]

Her temps are cooler at night when the humidity is up correct?

Yes, she's on a 12-12 schedule with lights and her temp at night is in the mid-60s.

The vet appointment is a drop-off situation? I have to drop her at 10am and they said pick-up time will be 330pm.

Is this a normal vet appointment for reptiles?

 

[Winnie5761]

Just checked the temps and the ambient temp is 75.4⁰ and basking is 80.2⁰. She's no longer gaping though. Am I being overly paranoid?

 

[Beppo]

Honestly you probably are but the only way you’ll know is if you go to the appointment we’ve all been there I rushed to an emergency vet in the middle of the night and nothing turned out to be wrong… but it’s also this vigilance that makes us good keepers. I hope everything turns out ok

 

[Gloriawood]

Yes, she's on a 12-12 schedule with lights and her temp at night is in the mid-60s.

The vet appointment is a drop-off situation? I have to drop her at 10am and they said pick-up time will be 330pm.

Is this a normal vet appointment for reptiles?

I’ve dropped my guy off and picked up later before.

 

[MissSkittles]

Hi. I’d like to say that maybe you’re over-reacting, but having a bubble coming from the nose is not a normal thing. Better to have her checked and play it safe. In the Covid days all appointments were drop offs. If the vet is squeezing her in and doesn’t have a free appointment time, that could account for that…or that is just how that vet does things. I would write everything down to give to them and be prepared with your questions in advance.
If she does have an RI, the concern is how did she get it so that it can be prevented from recurring. How often do you spray or mist? For how long each time? Do you use a fogger? When and what are your temps when using it? Do you use a dripper? Have a fountain or anything else like that? Can you post some pics of your entire enclosure, including lights?

 

[MzLaurie]

Yes, she's on a 12-12 schedule with lights and her temp at night is in the mid-60s.

The vet appointment is a drop-off situation? I have to drop her at 10am and they said pick-up time will be 330pm.

Is this a normal vet appointment for reptiles?

Tell us what city you are in. Maybe one of us knows a good chameleon vet there.

 

[MzLaurie]

Btw Miss Skittles is a very very knowledgeable Cham mom. So you are in the right hands with her advice.

 

[Winnie5761]

How often do you spray or mist? For how long each time? Do you use a fogger? When and what are your temps when using it? Do you use a dripper? Have a fountain or anything else like that? Can you post some pics of your entire enclosure, including lights?

I use a dripper and keep it filled

I do not have a misting system or fogger. I mist her in the morning with a spray bottle. Also several times throughout the day, when her humidity starts to drop to 30. I mist for at least 2 minutes before lights out and I cover the sides of the cage with receiving blankets to keep the humidity up. I keep my bedroom extremely cold at night compared to most. I'll attach some pics. The new cage build starts Friday.

The new cage will have 4' T5 5.0 HO flourescent along with a 60w basking and a misting system controlled by an app. No fake plants. Several pothos, umbrella palms, mini palms, dragon plants and rubber plants. No net and better drainage.

 

[Gloriawood]

Missskittles is amazing. Take any advice she gives you. She was one of the main keepers who helped get me on the right track and save my guy from certain death. We were in a much worse situation and he was not well at all. I’ve learned so much from her

 

[EmilioTheAnkify]

To keep the humidity up I’d cut up a shower curtain lining and attach it to the screen. I use small magnets. And you might want to upgrade that uvb.

 

[Winnie5761]

To keep the humidity up I’d cut up a shower curtain lining and attach it to the screen. I use small magnets. And you might want to upgrade that uvb.

Doing all this with the new build this weekend.

 

[MissSkittles]

Ok. So with your new build you want to make sure not to block ventilation and keep the daytime humidity down. 30% humidity is perfect. I would limit the dripper to just about 15-20 minutes per day and instead mist or spray for at least 2 full minutes right before lights go on and off. The enclosure needs time to be able to dry out fully. You do need to remove and replace the artificial plants with safe live ones since our veileds like to nibble them. It only takes one bite for a serious bowel obstruction to happen. You can use the artificial plants attached to the outside to give your cutie more privacy. Live plants will add to and maintain humidity and provide little pockets of humidity where she can go if desired. Give her lots of branches and vines of varied diameters to travel and exercise. When she grows up and reaches her receptive phases, she will be endlessly wandering all of her branches in her futile search for a boy. Unless you are fully bioactive, remove the soil floor. Bioactive is a little bit intimidating to consider, but isn’t nearly as difficult as it sounds. If this is something that you are interested in, we can help you get it set up. https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/intro-to-bio-activity.2429/ You need a better and more reliable humidity and temp gauge. The digital ones with the wired probe end are good and many people use the ‘smart’ ones, like Govee. To contain and maintain humidity and prevent your walls from moisture, like @EmilioTheAnkify said, you can cover the back and/or sides with something, like a shower curtain, shrink to fit insulating window film, solid pvc or other panels, etc. You do not ever want to cover the top of the enclosure as that is going to reduce ventilation too much. It isn’t so much that high heat and humidity cause respiratory infections, but it is also poor air ventilation. The wild veileds who are living in south Florida are in a very humid area (basicallly is a swamp). They don’t have the RI problem because being outside, there’s unlimited ventilation.
Now a couple of other observations…also like @EmilioTheAnkify has said, you need to correct your uvb. I’m afraid the screw in uvb isn’t able to provide the levels your cutie needs unless she is about 2-3” directly under it. You need to get a linear T5HO fixture (as long as your enclosure is wide) with either a ReptiSun 5.0 or Arcadia 6% uvb bulb. There are units which are a few $$ cheaper than ReptiSun or Arcadia, but I have tested the output of the more reputable one and it is very poor. Correct uvb is one of the areas that can not be compromised upon. Once you get the correct uvb, you then want the basking branch to be about 8-9” below it. I’m not sure why the lamp on the side is there, but I’m going to say to remove it. The light should only be coming from above. The basking area should be the hottest spot at about 80F. You want cooler areas that she can move to when she wants. You want lots of plant cover that she can hide in and take shade under if she wants. You want to recreate a forest edge or tree. I’ll add some pics of my enclosures to give you an idea. You can use natural branches from outside, just avoid pine, eucalyptus and others with sap or strong odor. Give a little scrub with dish soap, blast with the hose to rinse and dry in the sun. To attach them and plants, there are Dragon Ledges https://dragonstrand.com/dragon-ledges/ which are awesome! You can attach garden trellis to the frame or create a little scaffolding attached to the frame. Never attach anything to the screen…it will rip. Lastly, while your little girl is a bit young right now, she will soon be old enough to reproduce and you’ll need to leave room for a lay bin. This will help when that time comes. https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/veiled-chameleon-laying-101.2488/
Also, make sure your supplements are perfect - phosphorus free calcium without D3 lightly dusted at every feeding (except when using a different supplement). Then a multivitamin twice a month and a D3 twice a month (not on the same days). The easiest is to use a combination multivitamin and D3 product like Repashy calcium plus LoD or Reptivite with D3 for one feeding every other week.

 

[Winnie5761]

Thanks so much to everyone for their help and suggestions.
We are getting ready to head to the vets office but of course she looks perfectly fine this morning! Moving around, basking, not gaping, nice color. Oh well. She needed a check-up anyway.

All of the suggestions I received will be followed in the new build which I'm going to talk my husband into starting today. Ups FedEx and usps are going to hate me! I think I have 8 packages arriving today!

Ok. Off the the vet. Wish us luck!

 

[MissSkittles]

Of course I forgot to add the pics.

 

[Gloriawood]

Good luck!!