House light bulb Vs. Basking bulb

[broderp]

I'm using a bulb that is 72W (claims to have the output of a 100W) that I bought at Wal*Mart. (4 pack for like $2)

I am also using a Lutron lamp dimmer from Lowes (for like $8).

I am able to use the same bulb year round (in theory, as I have only started using this in the last few weeks) as I can "tune" the heat for my cham.

Currently in this winter spell, I have it about 75% on and his temps are right in the 90-94F range.

When I get my bigger terrarium, I'm sure my temps will need to be recalibrated, and I may go to a true 100W bulb, but being able to dim it and control the output makes this a fairly simple change.

 

[sks021973]

Yes. This is what I use in my enclosures and it provides me with a sufficient basking spot.

What size and type enclosure do you have?

 

[Extensionofgreen]

If you want to "splurge" the incandescent, Sylvania SpotGro bulbs bring out good colors in basking animals and are favored by sun-loving species, over standard household bulbs, IME.
Of course, the plants will appreciate them, too.
Expect 3-4 months out of your $5-$8 investment.

 

[Caarson]

Well according to an article written in 2014, "Reptile Lighting: A Current Perspective"
(http://www.anapsid.org/gehrman2.html)
The essentials for reptile lighting are;

• UVB light ;

"studies exploring the importance of vitamin D and UVB to the health of reptiles, with particular reference to calcium metabolism and bone formation. These studies contributed to the development of the variety of reptile lamps available today."

• UVA light

"UVA can influence agonistic, reproductive, and signaling behaviors in some species of lizards (Gehrmann, 1994A) as well as inhibit growth in female panther chameleons, Chamaeleo pardalis (Ferguson, et al., 1996).​

Thus, we also can see noted that the household bulb, & reptile bulbs were not that different;
"However, short or long term health benefits attributable to the use of full-spectrum light have not been experimentally demonstrated."
cited; What is Full-Spectrum Lighting?


In conclusion there is currently no difference between these bulbs.
Just make sure that UVB light and UVA light is somehow getting to your animal.

 

[Extensionofgreen]

That site is also very opinionated and biased against certain types of lighting. While that site is a great resource for certain aspects of animal care, those of us who have kept animal and plants for years know that lighting of the correct spectrums has a profound influence over the physiological and psychological health of an animal. You can absolutely use a household bulb, but you need to pay attention to the color temperature of the bulb and aim for 5000k-6500k. Also, "reptile" bulbs also have the advantage of being designed to focus the heat and light downwards and that can be advantageous in many instances. It's not the source or name on the package that makes a bulb suitable, it's the specifications of the bulbs and it can be labeled whatever it might be and sold wherever it might be and may or may not be a good fit for chameleon keeping.

 

[Caarson]

I always enjoy some disagreement, it makes sure that we get the correct answer.

Now, I've been using a household light for awhile.
Let's take a look on how thats gone for me. Using a Halogen Reflector Bulb, that can be found at
(https://www.walmart.com/ip/Satco-Sa...38-FL30-E26-Xenon-Halogen-Light-Bulb/39381623)
the light bulb is currently generating 84° at the middle of the cage, 145° at the top and 80° at the bottom.
Room Temperature is 68°

To address you're first statement, you said ;
"Also, 'reptile' bulbs also have the advantage of being designed to focus the heat and light downwards and that can be advantageous in many instances."

Seeing that the median temperature of the cage would be 103° and the median for a veiled chameleon's survival is 83 (Veiled Chameleon Care Sheet - Reptiles Magazine) this light is clearly superior in providing proper temperature.



Now to address your other statement
"That site is also very opinionated and biased against certain types of lighting. While that site is a great resource for certain aspects of animal care, those of us who have kept animal and plants for years know that lighting of the correct spectrums has a profound influence over the physiological and psychological health of an animal."

I apologize for any bias source I may have inserted. But I would also like to bring up that UVB and UVA is not an uncommon thing, as many source also state the same requirements ;

• https://books.google.com/books?hl=e...6M#v=onepage&q=lighting of chameleons&f=false
• https://books.google.com/books?hl=e...T4#v=onepage&q=lighting of chameleons&f=false

Getting a light bulb that can emit both like this one:
click here
will let you use household light bulbs as a basking site.






Just to clarify, this message is not meant to attack you in anyway, I'm just trying to make sure that the right information can be determined

 

[Extensionofgreen]

I don't dispute that a household bulb can be used. I also did not say a "reptile" bulb was needed for every situation, only that they can be advantageous in many instances for projecting the right amount of heat.
It is also not a good idea to recommend Mercury Vapor bulbs as a go to. Many are too intense and are only advised in specific set-ups and by people that have more experience than many of the newer people that utilize the forum.
For the record, I use and have used many types of lights, from aquarium and horticultural bulbs, to "reptile" and household bulbs, but I have the experience to know what I'm looking for in the bulb, independent of how/where it is sold and how it is marketed. I'm not in disagreement with you, I'm just pointing out that the term "household" bulb has many incarnations under it and there are reasons to use "reptile" bulbs in some cases and not just any household bulb should be considered ideal, although several would serve the purpose.

 

[Caarson]

I don't dispute that a household bulb can be used. I also did not say a "reptile" bulb was needed for every situation, only that they can be advantageous in many instances for projecting the right amount of heat.
It is also not a good idea to recommend Mercury Vapor bulbs as a go to. Many are too intense and are only advised in specific set-ups and by people that have more experience than many of the newer people that utilize the forum.
For the record, I use and have used many types of lights, from aquarium and horticultural bulbs, to "reptile" and household bulbs, but I have the experience to know what I'm looking for in the bulb, independent of how/where it is sold and how it is marketed. I'm not in disagreement with you, I'm just pointing out that the term "household" bulb has many incarnations under it and there are reasons to use "reptile" bulbs in some cases and not just any household bulb should be considered ideal, although several would serve the purpose.

Okay, great to hear!

At this point I think it'd be a good time to compile a guide on this as many people will probably look at this forum discussion for reference.

LIGHTING GUIDE FOR USING HOUSEHOLD LIGHTBULBS
​

Many people are using lightbulbs commonly used in lamps to provide a basking light for their reptiles.
If your looking to get cheaper and more available light bulb or simply need to get a temporary solution this guide can tell you what you need to know.

What type of light do I need?

There are two types of lights

1. Reflector Bulb

2. General Purpose Bulb

I would recommend the Reflector Bulb.

What wattage will I need for my lightbulb?

• IF

Your in a warmer climate, or your temperature in your house is above room
temperature a 60W bulb such as this one is a great choice

• IF

Your in a cooler climate, below 68°, your choice of bulb should be 80Ws

• IF

Your using a General Purpose Bulb 100w-150w is recommended anything lower will not provide the much needed heat, since the light isn't reflected downwards.

What other things will I need for my reptiles?

You will need to grab another type of bulb both providing UVB, and UVA.

You might also want a double lamp fixture incase you don't already have one.

 

[broderp]

Seems like its all based on opinion and what works well in a given situation. I will go out on a limb here and say that after reading this thread, I picked up a few things:

• Halogen or incandescent each have their place and both work well
• LLLReptile wants to sell "Reptile Lights" and not Wal*Mart bulbs. (don't expect a dealer to support the use of light bulbs that cost a few bucks!)
• This is a debate as old as the "glass" vs. "mesh" enclosure.

Seems like 85 F at a basking spot is the same weather it comes from any type of bulb. As long as you have the basics covered, the Cham should do just fine. The hundreds (thousands?) of animals that have been raised on this forum alone can probably attest to that.

So what if you already have UVB, 600K+ lighting & LEDs for plant growth?

Then another alternative would be the HEAT EMITTER for basking. Not a popular option, but it's what I like to use.

 

[Extensionofgreen]

It is much better to buy a "household" bulb, that provides a balanced lighting spectrum than it is to buy one of those blue "reptile" bulbs, that have everything to do with marketing and nothing to do with reptile physiology. That said, there are several good options as ambient lighting for plants and basking at a home improvement store and also good options from places that market the products from reptiles. It all depends on your knowledge and the needs of the animals which options work best and sometime they are about equal in meeting the needs of our captives.
There really isn't a debat on whether one or the other can be used or is better, either can give you what you needs, but it may be easier to find exactly what you need from lightyourreptiles.com, if lighting is a new subject to you.

 

[broderp]

It is much better to buy a "household" bulb, that provides a balanced lighting spectrum than it is to buy one of those blue "reptile" bulbs, that have everything to do with marketing and nothing to do with reptile physiology. That said, there are several good options as ambient lighting for plants and basking at a home improvement store and also good options from places that market the products from reptiles. It all depends on your knowledge and the needs of the animals which options work best and sometime they are about equal in meeting the needs of our captives.
There really isn't a debat on whether one or the other can be used or is better, either can give you what you needs, but it may be easier to find exactly what you need from lightyourreptiles.com, if lighting is a new subject to you.

LYR is a good resource, but before anyone tells you that their stuff is "The best" and all other stuff is crap - search for Odyssea lighting. Same thing, a fraction the cost. Just be sure to factor in a better UVB bulb or T5 if you need it. It drives me nuts when some people steer new people to LYR and make it sound like that is the only place to get reptile lighting. They sell the same thing on Amazon as well as other places as Odyssea lighting. But, from what I can see, LYR is a good resource for information.

 

[Extensionofgreen]

Without going down that road again, obviously the poster is not an expert on lighting and it's better for the chameleon and the poster to send to a place where they can get custom advice and proven products. It's the nature of any business that a customer promotes a business they have positive experiences with, even if that is not the cheapest option, the customer experience justifies the value and cost of the purchase. It's why people shop at Nordstrom's over Macy's or buy a Mercedes instead of a Ford....it's about the customer experience during and after the transaction, not just getting the core needs met. This poster is not going to get the information they need from searching for brand names on Amazon and if they can get it from LYR, they have earned that business.

 

[Dragon1516]

LYR is a good resource, but before anyone tells you that their stuff is "The best" and all other stuff is crap - search for Odyssea lighting. Same thing, a fraction the cost. Just be sure to factor in a better UVB bulb or T5 if you need it. It drives me nuts when some people steer new people to LYR and make it sound like that is the only place to get reptile lighting. They sell the same thing on Amazon as well as other places as Odyssea lighting. But, from what I can see, LYR is a good resource for information.

It is the same fixture not the right bulbs so telling a newbie to get that fixture and not telling them the bulbs aren't right is setting them up for failure. You are giving people false information that WILL kill their animal over time because the bulbs are not right. So there for because there are people like you that don't do your research and you think those fixtures come with the same bulbs I would have to say going to Lightyourreptiles.com and talking to Todd would be a very good thing for a newbie.

 

[broderp]

It is the same fixture not the right bulbs so telling a newbie to get that fixture and not telling them the bulbs aren't right is setting them up for failure. You are giving people false information that WILL kill their animal over time because the bulbs are not right. So there for because there are people like you that don't do your research and you think those fixtures come with the same bulbs I would have to say going to Lightyourreptiles.com and talking to Todd would be a very good thing for a newbie.

Please reread my post. I clearly said after the fact about the hood is that you should "Just be sure to factor in a better UVB bulb or T5 if you need it." I gave no false information so please don't try and discredit my post. You know nothing about me or how much research I do so don't go saying I don't. I probably try and dig deeper than many on this forum to get a fundamental understanding weather it be lighting, cages or even something as odd as cham poop. I weigh my options and try to separate fact from opinion and I quote fact and try to let people know if what I believe is my opinion so they can do what they want with it.

If I was looking for advise and steered towards brand "X" and told that this was the "one and only" "best" thing; I would be pissed to find out I could have received the same thing cheaper. Many new owners are young and or kids and don't have a lot of money. This is who I look out for. Let them have the facts to educate themselves and decide what to do from there. Some may choose it's better to pay now and be done, others will attempt to see if they can save a little and do more. This is my philosophy.

 

[broderp]

Without going down that road again, obviously the poster is not an expert on lighting and it's better for the chameleon and the poster to send to a place where they can get custom advice and proven products. It's the nature of any business that a customer promotes a business they have positive experiences with, even if that is not the cheapest option, the customer experience justifies the value and cost of the purchase. It's why people shop at Nordstrom's over Macy's or buy a Mercedes instead of a Ford....it's about the customer experience during and after the transaction, not just getting the core needs met. This poster is not going to get the information they need from searching for brand names on Amazon and if they can get it from LYR, they have earned that business.

Very true and well stated. I agree with everything you say. Value is in the eye of the beholder. Who are we to say the OP will see (or not see) value in something? In this case I couldn't justify the value in it for several reasons, maybe the OP does. It's about giving choices.

FYI, My wife has a car made by Mercedes. It's been in the shop more times since we bought it 3 years ago than my "old" Toyota ahs in the 5 years I have had it. There is no value to me in an overpriced object that depreciates when I can drive from point A to point B in and pay so much less.

 

[Dragon1516]

It isn't "IF you need if" It is needed and we are acting as if we where talking to a newbie right? so what makes you think they will even know what you mean. Sending somewhere and not giving them all the specifics is not doing anyone any good. And if you do the research wouldn't it be smart to tell the newbie all the details about what they need instead of telling them to look up another company fixture and not give all the specifics about the bulbs they need to change out. So sense you didn't explain it a newbie going to LYR would be the "best" for them because Todd will give them all the specifics. You don't want a newbie trying to figure out a cheap way to do it and because they have no experience mot likely it will not be done right so don't you think its safer to send them to a professional that will get them what they need?!?! Much safer for a new chameleon owner. And no one said it was the "best and only way" did they? No they didn't and thats not even what this argument is about. No one said it was the best and only way. however for newbies not knowing what they are doing i would say going to Todd would be the best.

 

[Caarson]

It isn't "IF you need if" It is needed and we are acting as if we where talking to a newbie right? so what makes you think they will even know what you mean. Sending somewhere and not giving them all the specifics is not doing anyone any good. And if you do the research wouldn't it be smart to tell the newbie all the details about what they need instead of telling them to look up another company fixture and not give all the specifics about the bulbs they need to change out. So sense you didn't explain it a newbie going to LYR would be the "best" for them because Todd will give them all the specifics. You don't want a newbie trying to figure out a cheap way to do it and because they have no experience mot likely it will not be done right so don't you think its safer to send them to a professional that will get them what they need?!?! Much safer for a new chameleon owner. And no one said it was the "best and only way" did they? No they didn't and thats not even what this argument is about. No one said it was the best and only way. however for newbies not knowing what they are doing i would say going to Todd would be the best.

I don't suggest a new Chameleon owner would go to one person for advice on their Chameleon, there's plenty of resources for those who need more assistance taking care of their chameleon. Here's just a few:

• https://play.google.com/store/books..._Essential_Care_of_Chameleons?id=E6cKBgAAQBAJ
• http://chameleoncare.net/
• http://www.reptilesmagazine.com/Care-Sheets/Lizards/Veiled-Chameleon/

Todd can sell you things to make taking care of a chameleon easier, but actually taking care of a pet requires knowledge of things that can make it sick, and things that can make it healthier.

You should already know those things before buying a pet.

 

[broderp]

I don't suggest a new Chameleon owner would go to one person for advice on their Chameleon, there's plenty of resources for those who need more assistance taking care of their chameleon. Here's just a few:

• https://play.google.com/store/books..._Essential_Care_of_Chameleons?id=E6cKBgAAQBAJ
• http://chameleoncare.net/
• http://www.reptilesmagazine.com/Care-Sheets/Lizards/Veiled-Chameleon/

Todd can sell you things to make taking care of a chameleon easier, but actually taking care of a pet requires knowledge of things that can make it sick, and things that can make it healthier.

You should already know those things before buying a pet.

Good points.

 

[Dragon1516]

I don't suggest a new Chameleon owner would go to one person for advice on their Chameleon, there's plenty of resources for those who need more assistance taking care of their chameleon. Here's just a few:

• https://play.google.com/store/books..._Essential_Care_of_Chameleons?id=E6cKBgAAQBAJ
• http://chameleoncare.net/
• http://www.reptilesmagazine.com/Care-Sheets/Lizards/Veiled-Chameleon/

Todd can sell you things to make taking care of a chameleon easier, but actually taking care of a pet requires knowledge of things that can make it sick, and things that can make it healthier.

You should already know those things before buying a pet.

Obviously you don't get the point either WE ARE TALKING ABOUT LIGHTS. This is pointless because people like you don't read the while post and start going off on another topic. This is a waste of time if no one can even stick to the whole point behind all this. Going on about Chameleon care and all that had nothing to do with the lights we where talking about.

 

[Caarson]

Obviously you don't get the point either WE ARE TALKING ABOUT LIGHTS. This is pointless because people like you don't read the while post and start going off on another topic. This is a waste of time if no one can even stick to the whole point behind all this. Going on about Chameleon care and all that had nothing to do with the lights we where talking about.

If you want to talk about lights you need to clearly outline what your talking about, because if 2 people don't get your point, it's not our fault. We simply request that you phrase it in a way that we can get what your talking about.

Maybe in a less aggravated way. No one is targeting you, nobody thinks your stupid. We just want to make sure we get what your saying, thats all.