I'm back!! Bowser!

[dropanuke]

Hi folks, been a while!

Just had bowser in the vets as his left hand kept loosing grip anyway the prognosis is that when he had a touch of mbd to which was caught early, he did suffer a fracture in his back right leg but healed very well, he has a slight case of arthritis, this guy sees chameleons all the time and told me that he's the best conditioned chameleon for his age that he has seen in quite some time.

A blood test is underway and Monday I'll have the results as to whether he can have the loxicon medication or not.
On Monday I'll be posting some new pictures on here.

Ps the mbd he had when young is very well controlled according to the vet so I took a lot of confidence from that not that I needed it. Here's a picture of bowser from a couple of years a go

 

[alphakenc]

Hi folks, been a while!

Just had bowser in the vets as his left hand kept loosing grip anyway the prognosis is that when he had a touch of mbd to which was caught early, he did suffer a fracture in his back right leg but healed very well, he has a slight case of arthritis, this guy sees chameleons all the time and told me that he's the best conditioned chameleon for his age that he has seen in quite some time.

A blood test is underway and Monday I'll have the results as to whether he can have the loxicon medication or not.
On Monday I'll be posting some new pictures on here.

Ps the mbd he had when young is very well controlled according to the vet so I took a lot of confidence from that not that I needed it. Here's a picture of bowser from a couple of years a go

Welcome back dropanuke,we want to see more updates.....God bless...,yup...yup

 

[dropanuke]

Welcome back dropanuke,we want to see more updates.....God bless...,yup...yup

Just got off the phone to the vet.

His early mbd is great so I'm proud of that part but the test results are showing his uric acid level is 1200 when should be bellow 700 so he has severe gout.

There is not much I can do now but try and beat nature.

Advice anyone? Bowser is not even old man and I have done everything that is the pinnicle for a chameleon so I refuse to admit mistakes I guess I'm just unlucky!!!

 

[dropanuke]

Any suggestions? Surgery? Operation? This little fella is not going to die unless nothing can be done

 

[carol5208]

Depending on how bad the gout is, there is surgery that can be done to remove the uric acid deposits(tophi), atleast from the joints anyways .Did you vet detect gout in xrays or just from bloodwork? Is it noticeable when you look at him? Does he have gout in his organs or joints??? I know there are two kinds of gout: visceral(organs) and articular(joints). I guess that is something your vet would have to determine. If he is a candidate for surgery, then ask yourself if you are really improving his quality of life with minimal suffering. Bottom line is, there is something awry with the kidney function to not be eliminating the uric acid through waste. Kindey failure seems to be a common problem with these guys and it happens to chameleons that are well taken care of. It is just like people...why does one person get a disease and another doesn't? I have dealt with gout first hand. My Sambava, Romeo ended up with a injury to his foot. This led to vet visits, stress, meds and an ongoing problem with the foot getting reinjured. One day I looked at him and his knee was all swollen. I took him back to the vet and bloodwork indicated gout. Also a needle biopsy was done and you could see the spiky uric acid crystals under the microscope. No wonder why it is so painful. I put him on pain meds and about a week later I found him at the bottom of the cage with his mouth open. I ran him to the vet, but we decided the humane thing was to put him down. i think there will come a time for you when you have to decide what is better for your chameleon and how much quality of life he has. I never blamed myself for anything, because like you, I gave him the best of care. Good luck to you!

 

[dropanuke]

Depending on how bad the gout is, there is surgery that can be done to remove the uric acid deposits(tophi), atleast from the joints anyways .Did you vet detect gout in xrays or just from bloodwork? Is it noticeable when you look at him? Does he have gout in his organs or joints??? I know there are two kinds of gout: visceral(organs) and articular(joints). I guess that is something your vet would have to determine. If he is a candidate for surgery, then ask yourself if you are really improving his quality of life with minimal suffering. Bottom line is, there is something awry with the kidney function to not be eliminating the uric acid through waste. Kindey failure seems to be a common problem with these guys and it happens to chameleons that are well taken care of. It is just like people...why does one person get a disease and another doesn't? I have dealt with gout first hand. My Sambava, Romeo ended up with a injury to his foot. This led to vet visits, stress, meds and an ongoing problem with the foot getting reinjured. One day I looked at him and his knee was all swollen. I took him back to the vet and bloodwork indicated gout. Also a needle biopsy was done and you could see the spiky uric acid crystals under the microscope. No wonder why it is so painful. I put him on pain meds and about a week later I found him at the bottom of the cage with his mouth open. I ran him to the vet, but we decided the humane thing was to put him down. i think there will come a time for you when you have to decide what is better for your chameleon and how much quality of life he has. I never blamed myself for anything, because like you, I gave him the best of care. Good luck to you!

I'm going to be upfront and realistic!

He is in discomfort I know that and his front left hand is not gripping the branches because of the joint, it was realised via bloodwork.
The medication will apparently make his four worse which tells me he hasn't got long, the vet told me he has months, what would you do? Be upfront also.

 

[carol5208]

If you think he is in pain and know he is not going to live long, I would probably make the decision to put him down. There were a few times when I took Romeo to the vet, that I felt like I was prolonging his life for me, not him. I did not want to see him go. That day when I saw him on the bottom of the cage, I said, to myself, this is ridiculous. When I got him to the vet, he agreed with me it was the right thing to do and have him humanely euthanized. I think the medicines we give them can wreak havoc on their organs and eventually that is what happened in the case of mine. I think the gout came from the kidneys just not being able to function properly from all the meds he was given. It is a double edged sword so to speak.

 

[dropanuke]

If you think he is in pain and know he is not going to live long, I would probably make the decision to put him down. There were a few times when I took Romeo to the vet, that I felt like I was prolonging his life for me, not him. I did not want to see him go. That day when I saw him on the bottom of the cage, I said, to myself, this is ridiculous. When I got him to the vet, he agreed with me it was the right thing to do and have him humanely euthanized. I think the medicines we give them can wreak havoc on their organs and eventually that is what happened in the case of mine. I think the gout came from the kidneys just not being able to function properly from all the meds he was given. It is a double edged sword so to speak.

I am grateful for your responses!

I even thought of cranberries for gut loading and cranberry juice in his water so it helps his organs but is it a drop in the ocean?
Is it only delaying the inevitable?

Two chameleons I have owned and dizzy got To 6 1/2 and was egg bound and passed and now bowser and its ripping me to bits

 

[carol5208]

I mean anything is worth a try I guess, but would probably consult with my vet on any home remedies. Unfortunately in life we sometimes have to follow our head instead of our heart! I dont envy the situation you are in.

 

[kinyonga]

Sorry I didn't answer earlier but Carol gave you some good information and I was trying to look up more information.

Vet's seem to use allopurinol to treat gout. Why is your chameleon using Loxicon? From what I understand if the chameleon has gout it could be that there are kidney issues too. It's important that the chameleon is well hydrated to help the kidneys. Chameleons lack the loop of henle that allows some reptiles to be able to "recycle" water in times of need...so hydration is really important for the chameleons to prevent uric scid build up in the first place.

From what I've read, heard learned from experience...gout is not very successfully solved in chameleons sadly.

 

[alphakenc]

I am grateful for your responses!

I even thought of cranberries for gut loading and cranberry juice in his water so it helps his organs but is it a drop in the ocean?
Is it only delaying the inevitable?

Two chameleons I have owned and dizzy got To 6 1/2 and was egg bound and passed and now bowser and its ripping me to bits

Stay strong and hope the best,you will know what to do no matter what happen...God bless all these good people around you and You dropanuke!!

 

[dropanuke]

Stay strong and hope the best,you will know what to do no matter what happen...God bless all these good people around you and You dropanuke!!

Many thanks!

If there's one thing I can't stand in life it's adversity! You know almost everything I do in my life I always find a way to solve it but this is so darn difficult.

It ain't over til the fat lady sings!!

 

[alphakenc]

Pleasure will be all mine,we fall,we learn from the experience and we get back stronger exactly like you say!!!

 

[wodesorel]

dropanuke, I am so sorry you are going through this. I know how agonizing it can be.

There were a few times when I took Romeo to the vet, that I felt like I was prolonging his life for me, not him. I did not want to see him go.

I am always horrified when a vet thanks me and my husband for deciding to humanely euthanize one of our pets. And it's been multiple vets on multiple occasions. With advances in medicine today, the question needs to be 'should we', not 'can we'. Not enough owners stop to consider this when making choices, and I commend those that do get to the point where they can separate themselves and think it through logically. It's heartbreaking, but no one ever has to watch an animal suffering towards the end. I've always found my vets to be very frank if asked "if it was your pet, what would you do". Sometimes they say give it a shot, other times they say enjoy the time you have left, and yet other times they will be very open about the amount of suffering occurring. I really don't think they don't get asked that question enough.

 

[jehovahgmolah]

I pray and hope your little one gets better. I believe there is always hope and you have to follow your instinct. May have to do everything by hand with a syringe to get him to eat and drink.

 

[dropanuke]

The vet has got back to me.

I will copy and paste his response here
"Bowser has gout, which in humans is painful. If he does not look more comfortable after a week or two on Allopurinol, we should consider putting him to sleep"

So the fat lady is singing

 

[kinyonga]

Maybe he will be lucky.

 

[dropanuke]

Pardon my sinisism but how is that lucky?

 

[kinyonga]

Maybe the allopurinol will work.

 

[gotwqqd]

The allopurinol should eventually work...the question is can you change the diet so he doesn't get further attacks?

With humans the attacks become closer together, more likely and can be more painful. Trust me I have it.

Can you put him on allopurinol regiment to prevent the attacks? I'm surprised he prescribed allopurinol...it can make the flair up worse. I'm talking humans here....usually for an acute attack indomethacin is prescribed or colchicine. Allopurinol is usually a daily preventative medicine.

Maybe increasing vegetation will work....animal protein is the major cause of gout...there are some veggies that MAY contribute but the jury is out on that.