New 3 Month Old. Couple concerns

A

agavrysh

New Member
Two days ago we picked up a small about 3 month old chameleon. I wonder if the cage is not too big for him.

Chameleon Info:

Your Chameleon - Veiled Chameleon, Male, about 3 month. Had him for 2 days.
Handling - Have not handled him yet after putting him inside. I really want him to get use to new home.
Feeding - I bought 40 small crickets from petsmart they said they are gutloaded and dusted. I have put all 40 inside, since the cage is big for him. So far I think he only ate like 10 of them. I also put some carrots on the bottom for crickets.
Supplements - For now i Have rep-cal herptivite, but will buy calcium with and without d3 in couple days.
Watering - For now I have a little plastic cup dripping water and misting about 5 times a day, because average humidity is only about 30%. I ordered room humidifier which should come in few days, I plan to put it right next to cage, hope it will increase humidity.
Fecal Description - He is been pooping like 2-3 times a day, looks dark brown and moist.
History - Had him for 2 days.

Cage Info:

Cage Type - All screen cage 2x2x4 feet. Vertical.
Lighting - For UVB i bought Zilla T8 tropical fixture that fits 24 inch bulb. I plan to change to reptisun 5.0 bulb in 4 months. I have put it diagonally on top of the cage so it would catch his movement area. For basking I use 100w basking light bulb. And Night Bulb 100w, but I don't use it now.
Temperature - Average temp during day time is about 80 F and 95-100 F the the basking spot (checked with temperature gun) Night temp doesn't go below 65 F
Humidity - Humidity is only about 30-35F. During day time its hard to keep it at this level, however my thermometer/hygrometer is 3-4 inches from basking spot. (Should I put it farther?) Like I said before, I am waiting on humidifier to put it close to cage.
Plants - No real plants now. I don't have many fake plants inside either. I am using thick vine that goes from one corner to another, and a thinner vine with many leaves that goes over and near the bigger vine. (U shaped, of course. Other 2 corners look a little empty for now, but plan to put more plants there too.
Placement - The cage is located in the corner between couch and balcony door. The cage is on the floor, so the top is 48 inches.
Location - I live in Phoenix, AZ.
 
Aww just a baby. Think you should try cup feeding him. Hope your not just leaving them 40 crickets in with him over night?? Bugs can and will munch on your cham while he's asleep. Leaving food in the viv also causes the cham stress, my 2 veilds hate having food they dont eat left in their vivs. You've only had him 2 days so hes prob getting used to his new home, they need time to settle. It's not uncommon for your cham to not eat for afew days when you first bring them home. Try the cup feeding, see if that helps. If he doesn't eat today then come back and maybe someone else can help x
 
Also you gotta get on that calcium and multi-vits thing as soon as!! Iam also thinking that 100F is way to hot even for a baby, bout 85-90 for a baby veild. (Well that's what I had mine at) def get him some real plants too. There is a safe plant list on this forum. x
 
I have killed all crickets inside his cage, and introduced cup feeding to him. As soon as I put it there, and he saw crickets inside, he was trying to catch them, but didn't realize that there is a wall. It was funny to watch :) I lowered the cup a little bit, and he figured it out :) Still struggling to keep the humidity up though... I been at the store today and asked for a plain calcium powder. When I got home I noticed that there is some other stuff along with calcium too. Is it normal, or it has to say only calcium in ingredients list?
 
First, HI!!!

I just wanted to note that some pet stores do feed their crickets and will dust them with supplements when you buy them.

This board recommends a higher standard of gutloading.

There are usually stabilizers included with the calcium. That's probably the extra ingredients you are seeing. It is important that the calcium does not have D3 in it, you need to give D3 a few times a month, but you need to give calcium every day.
 
Today, I have noticed that sometimes he opens his mouth to take a deep breath. Is something wrong? What could be a cause for that?:confused:
 
sometimes they will open and close their mouths like a yawn. That is ok. If they are holding their mouth open for long periods of time it could be a couple of things. If it is under your basking light, then the temp could be too high and he is trying to thermoregulate. If he is not basking and your cage is cool, it could be a respiratory infection and he would be having difficulty breathing. Most likely it is nothing to worry about but be observant and keep an eye out how often and how long he is doing it.
 
Well I don't see him opening his mouth much anymore, but I noticed him rubbing his left eye of the branches. Also he closes that left eye sometimes during the day, and it looks a little more sunken in than the right eye. What might it be? Thank you.
 
"It is important that the calcium does not have D3 in it, you need to give D3 a few times a month, but you need to give calcium every day."

when did that start happening? granted hes young. but your suggesting he use D3 only a couple of times a month? and calcium the rest of the time? a few times a month for adult but i go more like 2-3 times a week on a youggun. also you dont need to make them look like frosted crickets, lite is better. id forget the plain calcium but thats your call.

as far as the gaping, like was mentioned hes probably a bit on the hot side.

being little he has more surface area than an adult and will heat up much faster, id go with a lower temp while hes young.

is the shrunken eye is on the side he aims at the lamp it may be a bit dry or dehydrated if it is in fact too warm.

higher humidity will help him with the eye, as always i HIGHLY recommend some live plants. makes a big difference.

get a squirt bottle, or pressure sprayer. the drip isnt gonna cut it, and if something is in his eye youre going to want to try to flush it out

for now you could place him in a shower with lukewarm water. id tell you to leave him on a plant but you dont have one of those.... so you could just place the whole cage in there if it fits. make sure hes getting INDIRECT spray off the shower wall. or even aim the showerhead over the cage so you get a little trickle in.

as long as the intensity of the spray he gets is about the same as he would get out of a spray bottle or 2 and has somewhere to escape to if he hates it. you could also turn it down REALLY low and let it trickle in through the roof of his cage like a mini rainstorm.

OH and yeah the whole point of your thread, yeah id say its too big especially without live plants to take up the volume of the cage. if you can afford a smaller one, i would do that. but if you cant i wouldnt worry about the size, id just worry about filling up some of that empty space with furnishings.
 
agavrysh said:
Well I don't see him opening his mouth much anymore, but I noticed him rubbing his left eye of the branches. Also he closes that left eye sometimes during the day, and it looks a little more sunken in than the right eye. What might it be? Thank you.
Click to expand...
It COULD be a shed. They rub themselves on things to help the shedding start:)
DekuScrub said:
"It is important that the calcium does not have D3 in it, you need to give D3 a few times a month, but you need to give calcium every day."

when did that start happening? granted hes young. but your suggesting he use D3 only a couple of times a month? and calcium the rest of the time? a few times a month for adult but i go more like 2-3 times a week on a youggun. also you dont need to make them look like frosted crickets, lite is better. id forget the plain calcium but thats your call.
/\/\Can you explain further? I havnt heard much behind younger chams supplementation.
as far as the gaping, like was mentioned hes probably a bit on the hot side.

being little he has more surface area than an adult and will heat up much faster, id go with a lower temp while hes young.
Can you explain? Im confused, as a smaller animal would have less surface area? Or am I misunderstanding?:eek:
is the shrunken eye is on the side he aims at the lamp it may be a bit dry or dehydrated if it is in fact too warm.

higher humidity will help him with the eye, as always i HIGHLY recommend some live plants. makes a big difference.

get a squirt bottle, or pressure sprayer. the drip isnt gonna cut it, and if something is in his eye youre going to want to try to flush it out
He says he mists 5 times a day.
for now you could place him in a shower with lukewarm water. id tell you to leave him on a plant but you dont have one of those.... so you could just place the whole cage in there if it fits. make sure hes getting INDIRECT spray off the shower wall. or even aim the showerhead over the cage so you get a little trickle in.

as long as the intensity of the spray he gets is about the same as he would get out of a spray bottle or 2 and has somewhere to escape to if he hates it. you could also turn it down REALLY low and let it trickle in through the roof of his cage like a mini rainstorm.

OH and yeah the whole point of your thread, yeah id say its too big especially without live plants to take up the volume of the cage. if you can afford a smaller one, i would do that. but if you cant i wouldnt worry about the size, id just worry about filling up some of that empty space with furnishings.How can you be so sure? He hasnt shared a picture of the setup?
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
@solid snake

smaller you are the more surface per volume
kinda like surface tension
or eh how do i explain.
compare an elephant to a mouse.

"Watering - For now I have a little plastic cup dripping water and misting about 5 times a day, because average humidity is only about 30%. I ordered room humidifier which should come in few days, I plan to put it right next to cage, hope it will increase humidity."

i misread that i thought he said he was only dripping 5 times a day

"Plants - No real plants now. I don't have many fake plants inside either. I am using thick vine that goes from one corner to another, and a thinner vine with many leaves that goes over and near the bigger vine. (U shaped, of course. Other 2 corners look a little empty for now, but plan to put more plants there too."

he said it looked a little empty, and i assume it would with only fake foliage hanging from walls or draped over vines.

i could be wrong though. i personally pack mine to the brim with plants, i even plant spiderplants in the soil of the trees. thats one thing i do believe cant be overdone in a habitat. but to each his own. ive seen some cool stuff done without live plants. i just really advocate them becuase of the humidity issue. plus it helps me manage all the water from the misting system

but yeah, ive housed juvies in 2x2x4s and it just seems like a bit much to me, especially if thats going to be the size of the enclosure once they mature.
 
DekuScrub said:
@solid snake

smaller you are the more surface per volume
kinda like surface tension
or eh how do i explain.
compare an elephant to a mouse.
I believe what your saying is that since the animal is small, the same amount normaly used on an adult is too much for it, and that you recomend compinstating for this by limiting the number of days a week it is used. Sounds valid. I am of the opinion that the smaller feeders used for a young cham(having less surface area than an adult feeder) compinsates for this on its own. JMO
"Watering - For now I have a little plastic cup dripping water and misting about 5 times a day, because average humidity is only about 30%. I ordered room humidifier which should come in few days, I plan to put it right next to cage, hope it will increase humidity."

i misread that i thought he said he was only dripping 5 times a day
Ok. Yes I do that ALL the time:p
"Plants - No real plants now. I don't have many fake plants inside either. I am using thick vine that goes from one corner to another, and a thinner vine with many leaves that goes over and near the bigger vine. (U shaped, of course. Other 2 corners look a little empty for now, but plan to put more plants there too."

he said it looked a little empty, and i assume it would with only fake foliage hanging from walls or draped over vines.
I assume this as well. It just sounded like you were making alot of suggestions, when we dont have much info to work with. So I got the wrong idea about what you were saying.
i could be wrong though. i personally pack mine to the brim with plants, i even plant spiderplants in the soil of the trees. thats one thing i do believe cant be overdone in a habitat. but to each his own. ive seen some cool stuff done without live plants. i just really advocate them becuase of the humidity issue. plus it helps me manage all the water from the misting system
I fully agree, live plants make a HUGE difference.
but yeah, ive housed juvies in 2x2x4s and it just seems like a bit much to me, especially if thats going to be the size of the enclosure once they mature.
Click to expand...

Sorry if I was difficult. I just found it hard to understand the points you were trying to make. I appreciate you explaining further, and sharing your thoughts.
 
OMG... He got Sick and.....

Today in the morning, I have noticed that he had both of his eyes closed now and sits at the very top in the corner, right under the UVB light. For the first time his both eyes were closed. We took him out and started misting him with warm water, but 99% of the time his eyes were closed. He was walking around, pretty strong, but blindly (with eyes closed). We called a vet and scheduled soonest appointment for tomorrow. Meanwhile, I did some research and found out that vets usually give them terramycin, so I went to special pet store to buy it. On my way back, my wife called me and said that he started to show black spots on him (before that he was green all the time). He became very weak, and laid on his stomach. We continued to mist him, he often was raising his head and opening his mouth. In matter of few hours he turned more black and died.... It was horrific experience, to watch and not be able to help... We are really confused and frustrated what happened to him and what caused it. Just yesterday he was running around in his cage as usual......
When we bought him from petsmart, we noticed he had a little bumbs and dots sticking out a little from his rib cage area. We tried to do some research on it, and couldn't find a straight answer if it was OK or not. I have attached pictures of the enclosure and the supplements that I used, maybe we did something wrong...







 
Wow.. that really sucks :(

I had the same thing happen to my baby cham too, but thankfully mine pulled through. I got him when he was barely a month old. He was fine for a couple days but he started to just lay around with his eyes closed all day. He wouldn't eat or drink. He wouldn't even open his eyes when I would drip him with water or try to force feed him. I took him back to the small pet store I got him from and they gave him appetite stimulants and kept him for 2 weeks for me while he got stronger. I've had him in my care for 2 weeks now and he's thriving now. That's crazy how fast your cham got sick. My little dude was like that for almost week before I took him back in.

That's really sad though man, it was definitely petsmart's fault not yours. All of their chams always look terrible.
 
EDIT: My bad didn't see page 2....sorry to see its too late. These are not "easy" animals to take care of as you have found out. There were several errors in your husbandry however :(
 
Very sorry to hear about the little guy. I hope this doesn't discourage you from trying again. Should you choose to get another, I would do more research before and avoid buying baby chams from a pet store. This is the best place to buy from a reputable breeder that will give you a healthy quality pet. Best of luck and again very sorry for your loss.
 
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