New build (inspiration needed)

SliK JiM

SliK JiM

New Member
It's that time of year again when I start to think of the next project..

As it stands, I'm looking at building a double enclosure that will fit nicely into a room 8' wide (so each enclosure will be 4' wide). Here's a preliminary draft idea:

a.jpg


The whole thing will stand 10' tall and fill from floor to ceiling so that it is completely built in. It should follow pretty much the same plan as my last build, but I want to spice it up and do things differently. Anyway, was just looking for some inspiration now as this probably won't come into fruition for a while!

So if anyone could help me with the following that'd be great!

1) I want to do a fake wall type thing, but build into places to have plants (so some can grow down etc). Any suggestions (hopefully links) on how to do it? Also, should i build the fake wall after constructing the unit or can it be done in the garage and assembled in situ? I figure this will make it a lot harder!

2) What's the best way to do the doors? Given this will be built in, there won't be much room for my normal hinge on the outside approach, so is there a better type of hinge/style of door to use?

3) I want to build the bottom out of plexiglass as I wan't to use it as a giant planter again. Will i need to use anything else other than silicone sealant (like the stuff used in fish tanks) to hold it together?

I can't think of anything else right now (other than that I forgot about where all my wiring and such would go - so i better add 2 'fake' side parts to hide them behind) that I'm struggling with but I will post them up when I do.

I really fancy trying something stupid like making the basking bulb arc its way from left to right to simulate the movement of the sun, but then I realised that that was just insane and would take me forever to build! Still, crazy suggestions like that are also welcome!

Thanks all!
 
o_O looks like it will be awesome.


Silicone is a great sealant and adhesive. If you are making this out of like 1" thick melamine, which is like, high density particle board, with a finished, whit surface, make sure you PRE DRILL your holes, then use wood screws, PRE DRILL!

I assume you already knew that, if you are taking on this project, and the quality of your rough draft seems professional.

Back to silicone, make sure you use 100%, aquarium grade, silicone. Some are toxic, and once they fume off, they no longer contain any VOC(volatile organic chemicals) but it can take a long time for them to dissipate completely. The same goes for any paint you may want to use if this is a wooden enclosure you will be painting to make look nicer.

I'd screw it together, then seal with silicone so its water tight at the bottom.


Though not a chameleon cage, I just built this out of some 1"x1" framing, veneered particle wood stuff, and 1/8"melamine for the back, with 1/4" sliding plate glass front. Nearly finished, just have to decide how I want to mount lights, and cut accordingly, and decorate. Looks great, not an eyesore like plywood cages.

UGGGGGGGGGGGGHH WHY CAN'T ALL FORUMS AUTO RESIZE IMAGES TO FIT TO PAGE. Click the thumbnails.



 
Howdy Jim,
I just replace the drainage drawer plexi bottom in one of my cages due to the plastic seams coming loose and causing a leak. I have been using PVC shower pan liner for the drain tables that I set all my cages on. You could line the bottom of your cage with that stuff and it would never leak. Its made for going under the tile on a shower floor. For the cost of lining the bottom with plexiglass and sealing the edges, you could get plenty of PVC liner the just lay it in the bottom to conform to the sides and put your dirt with drainage gravel ontop of it with hardly any effort compared to cutting sheets of plastic to fit. The link below shows the draintable design I use that you could alter to complete your cages drainage system. JMO

https://picasaweb.google.com/101247792033429755142/Draintable#
 
SliK JiM said:
It's that time of year again when I start to think of the next project..

As it stands, I'm looking at building a double enclosure that will fit nicely into a room 8' wide (so each enclosure will be 4' wide). Here's a preliminary draft idea:

a.jpg


The whole thing will stand 10' tall and fill from floor to ceiling so that it is completely built in. It should follow pretty much the same plan as my last build, but I want to spice it up and do things differently. Anyway, was just looking for some inspiration now as this probably won't come into fruition for a while!

So if anyone could help me with the following that'd be great!

1) I want to do a fake wall type thing, but build into places to have plants (so some can grow down etc). Any suggestions (hopefully links) on how to do it? Also, should i build the fake wall after constructing the unit or can it be done in the garage and assembled in situ? I figure this will make it a lot harder!

Hey SliK, I am building a very similar unit at this very moment out of my tiny 1 bedroom apartment. A secondary issue I had to deal with was that my dimensions are 3'x3'x8' and will not fit through my doorways so I had to consider a way to take it apart later without losing my growth/destroying everything.

Here is a thread to the build as its progressing (I'll throw up some update pics tonight hopefully): https://www.chameleonforums.com/mega-self-standing-free-range-build-3x3x8-build-log-64531/

EDIT: Here is a direct link to the album https://picasaweb.google.com/110155...nFreeRange3X3X8?authkey=Gv1sRgCJ-1sdnW0KCejAE

I am using my own technique which is somewhat of a combination of the "silicone" and the "clay" methods. I build my walls on the "eggcrate/light louvre" with foam so it becomes somewhat stable and mobile on its own, then I use large screws + washers and mounting plates on the backwall to screw them on to. This way if I need to move the unit I can remove my entire false wall/plants without destroying them (to some extentn anyway).

If you aren't familiar with the methods I'm talking about, check out dendroboards or feel free to ask specifics :)


2) What's the best way to do the doors? Given this will be built in, there won't be much room for my normal hinge on the outside approach, so is there a better type of hinge/style of door to use?

I'm not sure on the technical name but if you google "invisible hinge" any of those type should do it for you (I think invisible hinge is the trademark name of some big manufacturer so it comes up first, but there are tons of cheaper alternatives at home depot).

3) I want to build the bottom out of plexiglass as I wan't to use it as a giant planter again. Will i need to use anything else other than silicone sealant (like the stuff used in fish tanks) to hold it together?

I'm not entirely sure what you mean here...you want the entire bottom of it to be just plexiglass and you are going to fill it with dirt/etc? Are you going to elevate it? I'd be *really* concerned about that holding up, esp once you water...

perhaps I'm misunderstanding?

I can't think of anything else right now (other than that I forgot about where all my wiring and such would go - so i better add 2 'fake' side parts to hide them behind) that I'm struggling with but I will post them up when I do.

Put a large piece of PVC (in hindsight on my build, I would recommend two separate ones, one for water one for power) You can see it in the pics on my build, I run my wires through this and then put a little block of wood to mount the back piece onto to (I'll hopefully have that done by tonight and throw some new pics up to show you)

I really fancy trying something stupid like making the basking bulb arc its way from left to right to simulate the movement of the sun, but then I realised that that was just insane and would take me forever to build! Still, crazy suggestions like that are also welcome!

Hahahah I LOVE THAT!!!

I'm doing something similar with my lighting:

2x2' bulbs -- 2x 3' bulbs -- 2x2' bulbs.
I turn on the outside set in the morning, with the middle 2x3' only being on from 12-6pm to simulate "noon sun". Additionally, I have his basking light on a dimmer that will also adjust from 6am (just barely on)-12noon(max)-6pm(turns off)

I haven't tested out just how much lighting I'm going to get though...I mayb e over doing it a little .... :x

Thanks all!
Click to expand...

Good lucK!
 
Thanks all! Some good links there!

Meow kitty - i saw that guys post on your thread and was hoping he might stick his nose in and say where he got his inspiration! I might drop him a pm!

Angrychair - cool, thanks mate. I'll make sure I use that sort of silicone when i build it then. Melanine board always crops up, but if im going to cover it like i intend, then it will be expensive when plyboard is dirt cheap!

Reptoman - that's sort of what I used in my last builds just that I found it really tricky to into a square box as I didn't want to cut it unless it somehow started to leak! Hence why i fancy plexiglass as it is rigid and will stay in shape!

Evillost:

1) Cheers! I'll definitely keep checking your build! I might have to join dendroboards as it looks pretty good for this sort of stuff!
2) Sadly dont have home depot in the UK, but i know what you mean by invisible hinges. My only issue with them is that they normally have a big mechanism on the inside that might corrode/rust with water and could get a chameleons leg trapped in them (which would not be pleasant!) I might try sliding doors that can be moved 100%. ie, double up the doors on one side so that the other has none if I really need full access. Now that i think about it, that would be pretty cool! :D
3) Yup! plexiglass all the way. I'd get relatively thick stuff and it would be well supported from below!
4) {if you follow the numbering} I might just add 2 little 'doors' on either side and put shelves in to store odds and ends. Nothing massive, just 15cm say to store vits/bulbs/vines/other bits and pieces away which could be used to run the wires up. Will be hellishly fiddly if it doesn't work!
5) Glad i'm not the only one with crazy ideas! At first i thought about making the bulb move and rotate which was just nuts! Then i thought about something like this:
Lightidea.png

So, the bulbs come on in sequence and follow the arc, gradually shifting the source from left to right. As they get closer to the middle they get closer to the chams increasing the heat and with less spacing and angle. But, just the idea of making a curved base with the bulbs going 'against the grain' as it were by not being perpendicular just seemed like a nightmare! Not to mention I would need some sophisticated lighting system, to turn the bulb on, increase the intensity to fullest, turn on the next while dimming the last! I'm still thinking about it though as it would be absolutely incredible! I might have to speak to summoner as he is the circuitry man!

That's enough from me for now me thinks! This project could be absolutely incredible if I plan it out right! I do love a good project!

p.s - i need to invest in a venus fly trap as I have a few gnats flying around tonight which are annoying the hell out of me!
 
p.p.s - keep the ideas coming anyone! I'm actually seriously considering this lighting idea now. I think i could make it work!
 
Well, new idea's were taken off dendroboard.com today. This guy has made an incredible background:

opbouw.jpg

wortels.jpg

overzicht_totaal1.jpg


Go check out the thread as it is incredible! http://www.dendroboard.com/forum/parts-construction/57563-pics-my-new-constructed-vivarium.html

Anyway, this got me thinking that doing something like this would be crazy on the sort of scale I want to do! So, does it sound crazy, to actually use half a real tree? I figure it'll be heavy, but if I fix it to a wall it should stay upright and it can't weigh much more than a massive TV (I'm talking smallish tree here! :p) Sound doable?

Altough, I do quite like the idea of having it as the middle of the enclosure like this (obviously not to scale):
b.png
[/IMG]

It would just look amazing!
 
Spray foam called Great Stuff and justs exterior grey paint some people use grout, others use a mixture of glue, moss, and soil.
 
popwell89 said:
Spray foam called Great Stuff and justs exterior grey paint some people use grout, others use a mixture of glue, moss, and soil.
Click to expand...

Cool! Thanks!

May sound like a stupid question, but could you use bark to cover it? Ie, if i was going to make a fake tree, do you think this would work?
 
This was my first time making one. I suppose if you have a strong enough glue i would just be worried about your cham climbing on it and pieces breaking off due to lack of glue strength. I would just be carefull using the moss and soil mixture with glue bc over time if it gets we some of the soils and things tend to erode off from my research. I didnt want to constantly be cleaning up a mess so i just did the foam and painted it.
 
I really like the tree root idea that someone posted. May want to do a smaller version of that at the base of the cage and just buy the tree bark cork background and cut it to your likeing and use it in the middle to cover the back? just an idea. hahahaha I love the creativity and trust me the one i made is the first of many to come
 
I stole the tree root idea from dendroboards. They do some incredible stuff over there, but not on the sort of scale I fancy!

That's not a bad idea! I am literally considering everything at the moment! As i said, it's a long way off yet (got to get my new house sorted first....) but I've set a budget at £500 (I'm in the UK so about $800 US) which seems like a lot but I'm sure it'll get spent! :(

Focusing on the lighting idea for now, gonna try out some ideas for the background/tree at the weekend!
 
@Slik: yea dendroboards is what got me interested in building the false environments...I have a few frogs but I am trying to adapt their methods for use with chameleons.


The biggest warning I can give you on any info you take from those guys: those frog tanks are generally misted several times a day and kept at near 100% humidity. Especially in the areas of plant growth and the clay techniques, you have to focus your water right in cham setups....the plants aren't as bad (esp if you root your cuttings elsewhere) but the clay background WILL crack very quickly if not misted very regularly!!

Also, don't use the clay technique anywhere near water....even a simple splashing will erode it much much faster than you would think.



For my water areas I use the technique popwell89 is talking about.

Simple rundown:

1)Use a base to hold your foam. I like egg-crate (lighting stuff, $12 for 2'x4') as it can easily be shaped and the foam goes into the openings and secures well....but it is also relatively expensive. I have personally used a sheet of styrofoam in the past as my back layer and this works cheaper (I know others who do not use anything and put the foam on the glass. I don't recommend this as it requires destroying your background to remove it generally).

2)Foam up over it. I use a mixture of Great Stuff regular (red cans) and the "large gap filler" (black cans). The black cans are designed to expand to fill larger wholes, so I use that first/mixed with the red can to develop a more varied background texture. WAIT for it to fully dry before going on (about 4-24 hours depending)

If you have any LARGE WOOD PIECES you can foam around them and they will generally be held in place. If the wood is exceptionally large/heavy, I suggest a simple washer/large screw from the back to secure it before foaming.

Personal tip: If you spray water on the foam as it is expanding it will STOP the expansion. It takes some experimentation but I like to spray my foam shortly after the outer layer begins to get hard. It tends to give it a "crackly" flat surface.

3) Two common variations here (some people skip this step, but I HIGHLY recommend it; otherwise you are much more likely to see "white spots" showing through over time):
-Peel off the outer layer of the foam. This takes time but is the BEST way. (Note: if you plan on doing this, there is no point in using the spray water technique I mentioned above as you will be peeling it off anyway).
-My way (not as good but waaaaaaaaaaay faster) get ROUGH sanding paper and sand down the entire outer layer.

The point here is to rough up the surface. The foam dries with a VERY smooth surface making it poor for adhesion in the next step. We want to rough it up a bit so that our mixture sticks better. In the long run, this does end up making a large difference in the number of bald spots from my tests.

4) Prepare your "mixture". 3 common techniques here:

#1: More common, MUCH cheaper. Get lots of silicone (I prefer brown, black is good too)....I personally use GE Windows and Doors II. It comes in all 3 colors and does not have MOLD INHIBITORS (you do NOT want these, so do not use any "bathroom" or "kitchen" grade silicone as these almost always have them).

#2: Wood glue. Titebond II is what I would use. This stuff is really expensive around here, but if you can find it cheap its the better product. You will need LOTS of it (don't plan on buying the little school size bottles...you need a gallon or two).

Also get DRY (and I mean really really dry) coco fibre/coco coir. You can buy the dry blocks and mix with water but make sure it is SUPER dry before you use it or it will NOT STICK. Personally, this is one area where I spend the extra $3 and buy the bagged stuff from the local pet store so I don't have to worry about drying it (it really hangs onto moisture!).

Thirdly, I use shredded long fiber sphagnum moss, the dried stuff in planters and whatnot (you can tear it up by hand even, but I find a blender works better). This stuff helps it hold together better and sometimes you get lucky and there are some spores left that end up growing on your wall randomly (but rarely). You don't need too much moss, maybe a 1:4ish ratio with the dirt.

Lastly, you are going to need some gloves :)

If you use Silicone: work in small patches (the silicone dries fast) apply a coat of silicone over the foam and smear it out well with your hand. Apply a copious amount. Then pour your coco/sphagnum mix directly on and push it in (pour WAY more than you need onto it and squeeze). I work in roughly 6"x 6" patches at a time.

If you use wood glue: Mix the glue, dirt, and moss in SMALL batches and "paint" it onto the background. I'm not very familiar with this technique as I have only done research on it, so I can't tell you more sorry...I have no idea on how much glue:dirt:moss you should use here, but if you find out plz let me know :)

Leave the entire background thing on the ground flat overnight for it to REALLY dry. Next day, just tap it lightly to knock off the loose materials and this should hold even under moderate water conditions (light stream, etc).



#3 is entirely different, the "clay" technique AKA "kitty litter": many people use kitty litter (and some brands work/don't work depending on the type of clay used in the litter...) Personally, I don't know why as real clay costs just as little as litter but you know what you are getting...

I use Red-Art for color and Sodium Bentonite as a binder (about 1:2 ratio). Mix with a little water and just apply it directly over the foam.

You MUST spray the clay regularly (and I mean *REGULARLY) or your clay will crack and disaster will strike. I have had my first 3 clay walls fail on me (I hand mist all those tanks so my misting wasn't reguar) however on my 1 tank with a misting system on timer, its going beautifully...

Also as I said before DO NOT USE THIS METHOD ANYWHERE NEAR A WATER FEATURE. This includes clay being too close to your misting nozzles! It will erode VERY easily (and given the amount of water we run in our tanks, very fast!!)

NOTE: Many people who use this technique do not use foam at ALL (they apply it directly on glass as it is easily moldable). I do NOT recommend this as wet clay is INSANELY HEAVY. I haven't seen anyone else use the foam+clay technique and it is my first try with it, but I don't see any reason it won't work and save me a ton of weight...

NOTE2: If you apply the clay by itself you must use a THICK 1-2" layer or it will collapse.


----------------------

Ok that was way longer than it had to be...

last note on that, to make the fake roots you can use various sizes of twine/rope dipped in the above-mentioned wood glue:dirt mixture. I just buy "Biovine" instead, its not that expensive and worth the time differential over buying wood glue and going through the hassle (downsid: it only comes in 2 similar sizes)



In reference to your light idea....how would you wire that up? I've studied electrodynamics in theory, but I'm just learning how to wire stuff up and whatnot....I don't imagine using like 6 different timers, there has to be a better way
 
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