Panic in the streets

[Lennoncham]

It is definitely being over blown I don’t disagree with that. The world is more connected then it was even a few years ago. That and the media is what’s driving the insanity. along with today’s freak out culture.

The governments are just trying to stop the spread so that what’s happening in Italy doesn’t happen here. But that also has to do with their culture and the massive elderly population. The media is just taking it to that freak out level.


I have been wondering as well what else is going on that they are distracting everyone from.

 

[skoram]

I wouldn't really call it contained. The US had 11 cases in 2014, and likely more since.

It's not as widespread sure.

The reality is however that the new data and doctors that are not pushing fear mongering are showing that COVID19 is no more deadly than influenza. We do not have anywhere near proper testing or confirmation of cases to give an accurate fatality rate for this. The one we are being given, the 2% is very likely grossly inflated.

There again, I say this freak out didn't happen for the 2009 H1N1. Which 80% of deaths were healthy adults, that were under 65. COVID19 is only fatal to immune compromised and Elderly. Any illness would likely kill those same folks. That is not a good example of a serious illness, that should cause mass panic like this.


I mean think about this.

COVID19: Under 65, Healthy no risk.
H1N1: Everyone is at risk.

Similar contaigousness, yet we didn't freak out for the H1N1 but did for this.

Like James said I hate sounding like a conspiracy theorist, however this is really seeming like a Mass Distraction, from something else.

Pretty much everyone, including health professionals agree, it's not that dangerous to most people. Symptoms and mortality rate are like the flu, maybe 1% higher, at most, if you take into account all the people who have it and don't even know. In Korea, the mortality rate is 0.6% and that isn't even counting 100% of people who have been infected.

What clearly seems to separate this from the flu is its infectiousness/contagiousness. It's brand new, people don't have any antibodies built up against it, there are no vaccines for it yet, there's no proven effective drug treatment like tamiflu. A cold could just as easily kill the elderly, but they are much less likely to catch a cold than the coronavirus, even if they come into direct contact with an infected person. If 1 person with a cold goes to a church, do you think it would lead to a thousand other people catching the cold? This happened in Korea. One person working at a call center in Seoul led to the infection of 40 other coworkers. Sound cold-like?

You can't hold a sporting event and ban people over the age of 60 or 65. Even if officials/media *strongly* advise them not to attend mass gatherings, a lot of them will go anyway. Alot of them, especially on the left, think the whole virus is a hoax. It could cost those people their lives. Whether or not we should let darwinism play out is subject for another debate.

I work in sports marketing and my firm represents some of the top athletes in the world, some ranked #1 in their respective sport. We have been hit HAAAARD by all the event/league/tour suspensions and cancellations. We negotiated an NBA league sponsorship deal for one of our major corporate clients and they have been nagging me non stop to try to get some reimbursement from the NBA due to the suspension (I already know it's impossible). Have you noticed I've been posting more these days (like now lol)? This is because my workload has been cut in half due to the coronavirus.

As much as it sucks for our company and for me personally, lives matter more than a bunch of guys or gals trying to put a ball in a hole. I read an article yesterday about the situation in Italy that was really sobering:

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/03/who-gets-hospital-bed/607807/

As of today over 31,000 people in Italy have been infected with the coronavirus. Like the cold or the flu, the vast majority of patients will probably recover. But I don't think the cold or the flu could ever create a situation like the one described in this article that Italy is facing. Almost no one is disputing the low mortality rate or the mild symptoms experienced by most. The problem is the crazy infectiousness and the incapability/lack of resources in most countries to handle an outbreak of this magnitude.

 

[skoram]

Regarding Ebola:

"Airborne transmission of Ebola virus has been hypothesized but not demonstrated in humans. Ebola is not spread through the air or by water, or in general, by food."
Annals of Global Health. Volume 80, Issue 6, November-December 2014, Pages 444-451

Ebola is far more scary and deadly, but it's not easily transmitted and therefore doesn't make for good comparison with the coronavirus outbreak.

 

[Han0915]

I live in LA and the panic is real. I was happy that I got what I needed to stock up and feed myself + my pets for the next 3 weeks or so. But when I went to Petco for worms, they were completely sold out. I managed to get one single cup of waxworms.... and the store had no idea when they'd get anymore in. I'm over here worrying about my pets more than myself tbh.

I breed dubia roaches so I'm hoping that alone will sustain my 3 (and soon to be 4th) chameleons + bearded dragon. Bought a combo pack of worms off mulberryfarms and will probably set up a superworm breeding factory to sustain my numbers long term. Out of all the things that would be out of stock, I didn't imagine worms being one of them LOL.

Definitely am worried about keeping my current baby + baby that is hatching in one month fed. Dubia numbers are good for now but I'm running low on nymphs. Pretty much just got adults + babies. Oh lord if I have to switch to crickets again, I will absolutely have a nervous breakdown. I hate those things lol.

 

[jamest0o0]

Meh, I guess what bothers me, is it shows how easily "america the free" can become not so "free". Just put up a shocking headline and people lay down like that, no questions asked.

 

[cyberlocc]

As of today over 31,000 people in Italy have been infected with the coronavirus. Like the cold or the flu, the vast majority of patients will probably recover. But I don't think the cold or the flu could ever create a situation like the one described in this article that Italy is facing. Almost no one is disputing the low mortality rate or the mild symptoms experienced by most. The problem is the crazy infectiousness and the incapability/lack of resources in most countries to handle an outbreak of this magnitude.

That's my point, the Flu is more contagious and spreads faster.

30k effected in Italy after a month, they had 3 million with the flu this winter after 2 months?

Half a million got it in a week.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.th...lf-a-million-people-struck-down-in-a-week/amp


The Flu is more dangerous, has been currently even with Corona been more spread and killing more people. The devil we know is still causing more damage the one we are freaking out about.

Antibodies and flu shots work for a strand ya, however the flu is constantly adapting and changing. You pretty much will not get the same strand twice, that applies to COVID19 as well. However you can get it again when it adapts enough.

If you contract COVID19 you won't get it again. Same thing with this year's Flu strain. I have young children, one in school. She brings the flu home every year, and even with shots we all get the flu, every year.

 

[cyberlocc]

Also, Sport events are one thing, and yes that makes sense shut that down. However the US is full on crazy. They just this morning forcible Closure on all Bars/Restaurants/Gyms/ECT in my Town, and County, yesterday they did the Same to my states Capital Phoenix Arizona, 7 million people there.

There is no food at grocery and now the restaurants are shut down, Never mind the economic issues, what about the people that didn't panic buy food? How are they going to eat?

Martial Law, seems not that far out, and I wont be surprised when that happens. Over a Flu? No I think something else is going on here.

Funny that a few news casters, spoke wild political theory's and have sense been taken off the air, all their shows have been discontinued until further notice, for Coronavirus updates, which is not even what has filled their time slots.

 

[skoram]

That's my point, the Flu is more contagious and spreads faster.

30k effected in Italy after a month, they had 3 million with the flu this winter after 2 months?

Half a million got it in a week.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.th...lf-a-million-people-struck-down-in-a-week/amp


The Flu is more dangerous, has been currently even with Corona been more spread and killing more people. The devil we know is still causing more damage the one we are freaking out about.

Antibodies and flu shots work for a strand ya, however the flu is constantly adapting and changing. You pretty much will not get the same strand twice, that applies to COVID19 as well. However you can get it again when it adapts enough.

If you contract COVID19 you won't get it again. Same thing with this year's Flu strain. I have young children, one in school. She brings the flu home every year, and even with shots we all get the flu, every year.

I think we have to be more careful when tossing numbers around and using them as a basis for comparison. I don't agree with how you used this analogy to draw the conclusion that the flu is more contagious/dangerous. I'm not saying you are wrong, just that you cannot draw that conclusion from your analogy. I will take it one step further and say that 13 million people in the US alone were infected with the flu this season, according to the CDC. 13 million!

Yet the flu is completely spread throughout the populace. There were no attempts to contain the spread of the flu, no travel bans, social distancing, etc. As you said, the flu mutates so vaccines are useless against certain strains. On top of that, it has been around for ages. I could twist this around and say, *only* 13 million?

By contrast, corona is very new. Hasn't even been in the U.S. for longer than a few months and only a few cases to begin with. Obviously there are many ongoing attempts to contain it. Neither I nor anyone else can even make a general guess as to how many people would be infected with corona if it had been around as long as the flu without any attempts to contain it, but I wouldn't be one bit surprised if it surpassed flu numbers.

My point - you can't compare 13 million vs. 5,000 or whatever it is now in the US and say that the flu is more contagious because those figures alone are devoid of context and almost nothing in the context matches anyway.

Ultimately, I think this is more of an indictment of medical systems/healthcare capacity than the danger of the virus itself. People are still getting infected with the flu, colds, measles, etc. and on top of that we add corona. Right now, hospitals seem unable to bear the additional load, hence all the talk these days of "flattening the curve."

 

[skoram]

Also, Sport events are one thing, and yes that makes sense shut that down. However the US is full on crazy. They just this morning forcible Closure on all Bars/Restaurants/Gyms/ECT in my Town, and County, yesterday they did the Same to my states Capital Phoenix Arizona, 7 million people there.

Are you sure about this? My understanding (and I should know because it's my business to know) is that no sports events have been forcibly shut down - all of them have shut down voluntarily. Some, like the UFC and a few small golf tournaments, are still carrying on, albeit with no fans in attendance. If sports events can still legally take place, it doesn't make sense that they'd shut down bars, restaurants, etc. If so, I agree, that is quite extreme and unnecessary.

Not a single public establishment has been shut down in Korea, no lockdowns or mass quarantines, and the situation has been improving daily here.

 

[cyberlocc]

Are you sure about this? My understanding (and I should know because it's my business to know) is that no sports events have been forcibly shut down - all of them have shut down voluntarily. Some, like the UFC and a few small golf tournaments, are still carrying on. If sports events can still legally take place, it doesn't make sense that they'd shut down bars, restaurants, etc. If so, I agree, that is quite extreme.

Ya I am sure.


From the Mayors Mouth, and its all over the news, she didnt mention Gyms, she shut those down too. One of the Largest Citys in America BTW,

They are now talking about Curfews, and more coming soon.

 

[jamest0o0]

Also, Sport events are one thing, and yes that makes sense shut that down. However the US is full on crazy. They just this morning forcible Closure on all Bars/Restaurants/Gyms/ECT in my Town, and County, yesterday they did the Same to my states Capital Phoenix Arizona, 7 million people there.

There is no food at grocery and now the restaurants are shut down, Never mind the economic issues, what about the people that didn't panic buy food? How are they going to eat?

Martial Law, seems not that far out, and I wont be surprised when that happens. Over a Flu? No I think something else is going on here.

Funny that a few news casters, spoke wild political theory's and have sense been taken off the air, all their shows have been discontinued until further notice, for Coronavirus updates, which is not even what has filled their time slots.

Couldn't agree more. I've been going on about this to my wife she is getting annoyed with me at this point.

At first I said why sporting events, but I get it I guess. However, I'm partial to the UFC and I see no reason why they can't fight with no crowds present, but ehhh what do I know.

@skoram UFC just canceled the next 3 events. Ferguson vs khabib about to be cancelled for the 5th time unless dana white can pull off a miracle by april lol... that fight is cursed.

 

[CasqueAbove]

Yeah I grabbed the last 6 at target but all the wipes are gone. Lucky I still have my cloth diapers!!! Ppl told me I was crazy doing cloth but who’s laughing now!!!

This may be something we (every one in the group) can help each other with. I am in Oregon between Portland and Salem. I have not looked for diapers or baby supplies, but If people are in need of such items, I am willing to look for them. I assume things are still available on line, but have not looked.


I am just suggesting maybe some of us can help each other with more than just chameleons.

 

[Christel]

We've had trouble finding sugar and other staples, but have now found some out of the way stores that aren't sold out. I agree, and if I can help from Texas, let me know.

 

[JacksJill]

^^That's the spirit.

 

[cyberlocc]

This is being sent around Facebook now, not sure how true. Scary though.

 

[Christel]

And sadly, posts like this lead to panic buying. Even more sadly, even if I WANTED to panic buy/stock up, we can't - husband's boss has been stingy with the paychecks ?.

 

[Tony_S]

My wife works as a teachers aid at a private school. So no school = no pay for her. I know a lot of people are in her situation that if they don't work they don't get paid. I hope this thing doesn't last much longer.

 

[cyberlocc]

And sadly, posts like this lead to panic buying. Even more sadly, even if I WANTED to panic buy/stock up, we can't - husband's boss has been stingy with the paychecks ?.

They are saying that the military will provide if you need on the news today, that they will provide grocery's and needs to those in need. Which just lends more Credence to this, Martial Law might becoming a reality.

Martial Law scares me more than this virus ever could.

 

[skoram]

They are saying that the military will provide if you need on the news today, that they will provide grocery's and needs to those in need. Which just lends more Credence to this, Martial Law might becoming a reality.

Martial Law scares me more than this virus ever could.

Wow wtf ....

A month ago Korea was the second worst-hit country in the world after China and the media was referring to Korea as the new "epicenter" of the coronavirus. There was a period where we were getting a thousand new cases a day. At the time, it seemed out of control. Yet, aside from schools and big public gatherings/events absolutely nothing was forcibly closed. People still rode the overcrowded subways everyday (I don't use public transport but some of my coworkers told me they saw no reduction in people riding buses and subways), still ate out for lunch every day. Some still went to restaurants and bars at night, though in much fewer numbers. I'm going out far less than I used to and avoid places where there might be crowds of people, like theaters, but I still occasionally go out for drinks at night (far fewer patrons means they are actually quite safe now) and went to play screen golf with some coworkers a couple days ago.

We do what we can to be careful. I am washing my hands so much these days that my fingertips are bleeding from dry skin cracks. We don't shake hands and try to keep a safe distance from everyone. Most of us avoid places and situations where there will be large numbers of people packed closely together (3 out of the 4 mass outbreaks in Korea started at churches). Korea now feels like one of the safest places in the world in terms of this virus outbreak. For the past 4 to 5 days the number of infected persons has been going down steadily after peaking at around 7,500. There is a constant stream of new cases but they are outweighed by the number of people recovering from the virus each day.

My whole point from the start has been that we should adopt a balanced perspective. This isn't the black plague but I don't think it's wise to say, at this point, that this is no worse than a common cold or flu, which might cause people to ignore safety entirely. But, at worst, I don't think it's that much more dangerous than the flu. The media is partly to blame for this panic but it's difficult for me to grasp the rationale behind forcibly closing bars, restaurants, etc. I've even read a number of media articles that say it's perfectly safe to eat out as long as you take certain precautions. And marshal law??

Personally, I don't even see why it's necessary to cancel/suspend sports events if no fans are in attendance. They can easily test all the athletes who will be competing beforehand. If anything, I feel that sports might be even more important these days if you are trying to convince everyone to stay at home and not go out. Athlete's are also the healthiest people in the world. The chance of a professional athlete dying if they caught the coronavirus is probably zero.

 

[skoram]

The coronavirus "aftermath" for me :




Saw this on the internet today and thought some of you might get a kick out of it: