Panther Chameleon Leg Hanging. Is this normal?

[nazareth]

I did go to the vet and they ran tests. He has no gout, kidneys are fine. no parasites They let me know that his calcium levels were at a 10 and phosphors was at a 6. They told me that calcium is suppose to be at a 15 and phosphors at 4. So I'm working on supplementation. Just 2 days ago I switched the UVB light to a 12% arcadia ( i did have the 10 reptisun) . I was just wondering if its normal for chams to just hang there limbs from time to time and yes he still walking and climbing but just a bit less now. I bought the calcium without D3 and dusting insects with it. Any recommendations on what kind of veggies, fruits, or feeders to give him. I'm just looking for other feedback from chameleons owners as well.

 

[MissSkittles]

Hi. Did they take any x rays of that leg? It definitely looks swollen to me. Is he able to grip strongly with it?

 

[Beman]

Hey there. What type of fixture are you running for your uvb? A 10.0 bulb and a 12% are really strong for a cham depending on the distance you have and the fixture type.

What supplements are you using and what is the rotation?

 

[MissSkittles]

We can do a total husbandry review if you like. There may be something off that contributes to his leg hanging. If you’d like to do that, just copy & paste the following with your answers.
Chameleon Info:

• Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
• Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
• Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
• Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?
• Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
• Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
• History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.

Cage Info:

• Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
• Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
• Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
• Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
• Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
• Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
• Location - Where are you geographically located?

Current Problem - The current problem you are concerned about.

--------------

Please Note:

1. The more details you provide the better and more accurate help you will receive.
2. Photos can be very helpful.

 

[nazareth]

Hey there. What type of fixture are you running for your uvb? A 10.0 bulb and a 12% are really strong for a cham depending on the distance you have and the fixture type.

What supplements are you using and what is the rotation?

Hi! I had him for about 3 years and always used a 10.0, recently switched to 12% however it is about 12inches from where he is. He loves hornworms and i dust them once a month with calcium with d3. He eats lots of blueberries, after doing my research it seems like those are high is phosphorus so I stopped giving him those

 

[nazareth]

We can do a total husbandry review if you like. There may be something off that contributes to his leg hanging. If you’d like to do that, just copy & paste the following with your answers.
Chameleon Info:

• Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
• Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
• Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
• Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?
• Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
• Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
• History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.

Cage Info:

• Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
• Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
• Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
• Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
• Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
• Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
• Location - Where are you geographically located?

Current Problem - The current problem you are concerned about.

--------------

Please Note:

1. The more details you provide the better and more accurate help you will receive.
2. Photos can be very helpful.

 

[nazareth]

Chameleon Info:

• Your Chameleon - 3 year old Panther Chameleon
• Handling - 1-2 hours
• Feeding - Loves Hornworms and Blueberries. Will eat wax worms, super worms sometimes. I do not gut-load my feeders. He eats 2 times a week.
• Supplements -Repti Calcium without D3 as of 2 days ago. Repti Calcium with D3 from previous times. twice a month and Repetitive once a month
• Watering - He likes when I give him water through a syringe ever since he was a baby. Sometimes he will lick leaves and I will spray them with water
• Fecal Description - He was tested for parasites 3 days ago and he has none. His poop is a little gooey sometimes but looks normal for the most part, the pee is a white color
• History - I recently switched his UVB bulb to a 12% arcadia. I have xrays fro his visit a few days ago, I can also post on here if that helps.

Cage Info:

• Cage Type - X-Large: 24" x 24" x 48" mesh screen
• Lighting - 10-11 hours light on, 12% arcadia 24in I did put the lamp 5 inched away from where the screen top starts
• Temperature - 60-80 degrees
• Humidity -Im not sure on the number but i have the UVB, fogger, a Mist King and a 90ww heat bulb
• Plants - Potholes and Mass Cane
• Placement - In my office, above the cage there is a vent its about 45 inches away, well the cage is not directly underneath the vent
• Location - Chicago, IL

Current Problem - If leg is hanging from branch is normal, what can I do for him to not to that? Feeders and food recommendation, I have x rays too from days ago that I can send you.

 

[nazareth]

Hi. Did they take any x rays of that leg? It definitely looks swollen to me. Is he able to grip strongly with it?

Not like a super strong grip but yes he can still hold my finger. He said some of his bones look slight bent not too much but that's why he has me doing more calcium in diet and sent me home with medicine that lowers the phosphorus. What do you think?

 

[MissSkittles]

Give me a little bit & I’ll give a full response.

 

[MissSkittles]

• Your Chameleon - 3 year old Panther Chameleon
• Handling - 1-2 hours Is this per day, week??
• Feeding - Loves Hornworms and Blueberries. Will eat wax worms, super worms sometimes. I do not gut-load my feeders. He eats 2 times a week. Are these the only types of feeders he gets? None of these are staple feeders - are for treats only. The blueberries are completely not needed, especially for a panther. Chameleons lack the ability to properly digest plant matter and the high sugar content isn’t good for him. Attaching a couple of graphics for you. It’s so much better to give him a variety of staple feeders (roaches, crickets, etc) that you’ve ensured are as healthy and nutritious as possible by feeding them an assortment of fresh produce. You don’t say how many feeders you give per week or per feeding. I give all of my chameleons 3-4 decently sized feeders 3 days a week, plus occasional treats.
• Supplements -Repti Calcium without D3 as of 2 days ago. Repti Calcium with D3 from previous times. How often were you using the one with D3? twice a month and Repetitive once a month Does the Reptivite have D3? If so, you don’t need to give the other. The ReptiVite should be given one feeding every other week, regardless of it having D3 or not. Whatever calcium you use, it needs to be phosphorus free. Almost all feeders have a high phosphorus: calcium ratio. Since phosphorus interferes with the body’s absorption of calcium, we need to correct the imbalance. (Which is why we give supplemental calcium).
• Watering - He likes when I give him water through a syringe ever since he was a baby. You have a unique cham! Sometimes he will lick leaves and I will spray them with water This is how chameleons usually drink and how he should too. It’s best to mist the plants for at least 2 minutes, 2-3 times a day.
• Fecal Description - He was tested for parasites 3 days ago and he has none. His poop is a little gooey sometimes but looks normal for the most part, the pee is a white color
• History - I recently switched his UVB bulb to a 12% arcadia. Too strong! He needs a 6%. I have xrays fro his visit a few days ago, I can also post on here if that helps.

Cage Info:

• Cage Type - X-Large: 24" x 24" x 48" mesh screen Very good
• Lighting - 10-11 hours light on, 12% arcadia 24in I did put the lamp 5 inched away from where the screen top starts You need a 6%. A 12% is much too strong…is for animals like beardies who need strong uvb. Once you get the 6%, then the distance between light and basking area should be about 8-9”. This provides the ideal UVB index of 3.0. Until you can get the correct light, I believe you’ll want a distance of at least 12” between light and basking area.
• Temperature - 60-80 degrees That’s a pretty broad range. What is basking temp? For a male panther it should be no higher than 84-85, but at least 80. There should (hopefully) be a natural decline in temps lower in the enclosure. At night, if the temp is getting to 60, that is great.
• Humidity -Im not sure on the number but i have the UVB, fogger, a Mist King and a 90ww heat bulb It’s really important to monitor humidity levels. During the day the ideal range is between 50-70%. At night, if you can consistently achieve a temp drop below at least 70, you can use the fogger and boost humidity as high as you can. Never run the fogger during the day or when it’s over 70. Heat + high humidity increase respiratory infection risk.
• Plants - Potholes gotta love spell check and Mass Cane Very good. While panthers don’t eat their plants like veileds, live plants help maintain humidity and just provide the chams a more natural environment.
• Placement - In my office, above the cage there is a vent its about 45 inches away, well the cage is not directly underneath the vent
• Location - Chicago, IL

Current Problem - If leg is hanging from branch is normal, what can I do for him to not to that? Feeders and food recommendation, I have x rays too from days ago that I can send you.
I’m not a vet (just a lowly nurse) so don’t really have skill in reading x rays. However, with my limited skill, I don’t see any obvious fracture or displacement of bones. I’m not sure if it’s just the position of his leg or if he does have some sort of density (inflammation?) at the area I think looks swollen. I can only say that hopefully once you get his calcium & phosphorus levels corrected and make the changes I suggested, he’ll stop hanging his leg like that. Chams are amazing (and often adorable) in some of the positions they hang out in and at times, will let a leg or two dangle, but it’s not for long and not usually frequent.
What is the medicine that they gave to correct the phosphorus?

 

[MzLaurie11]

Well something is going on with the right lower leg. All the white in the xray near the ankle is edema. prevents mw from seeing bones well. Maybe a torn ligament? Btw collarf greens are really good for chams.

 

[nazareth]

Well something is going on with the right lower leg. All the white in the xray near the ankle is edema. prevents mw from seeing bones well. Maybe a torn ligament? Btw collarf greens are really good for chams.

Thank you and would you know how I can treat edema?

 

[Beman]

Edema is seen around the collar of the cham. You do not get edema in legs. https://chameleonacademy.com/chameleon-medical-edema/

 

[MissSkittles]

Hopefully with time and improved husbandry, your chameleon’s leg will get better. An anti-inflammatory medication may help, but those come with their own serious set of risks and problems and that may be why your vet didn’t prescribe one.

 

[kinyonga]

Sometimes a chameleon can get swelling in the leg if there’s an injury that maybe squashed the leg as it happened. I’ve only seen it once though….and I can’t say for sure it’s considered edema or tissue damage, since I’m not a vet.