Panther Egg Hatching. When to be Concerned.

[ColorsOfTheWind]

Soon to be first time chameleon owner looking for some advice on egg hatching.
I purchased a chameleon egg from an online breeder a few months back with an estimated hatch date of October 17th. I know that hatch date is very variable so I didn't get my hopes up. On Thursday (11/7) my egg began to sweat a lot. He continues to sweat through Friday and decreased in size markedly. Saturday he did not hatch but the egg continued to look moist. This morning (11/10) i noticed the shell took on a dry appearance with no progression to hatching. Should I be concerned that he is stuck? Should I mist the egg since the calcium dried? I'm a first time chameleon mom and I'm just worried something happened to him when trying to hatch.

 

[elizaann2]

Hello and welcome!!

I don't have any experience with eggs or babies @JacksJill or @kinyonga can you help?

I would suggest getting your set up reviewed now to ensure you have everything dialed in, babies are quite fragile and having even small mistakes in your husbandry can be detrimental to your little one. I've copied our review form below, just copy it and paste it in another reply - the more information you can give us the better

Chameleon Info:

• Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
• Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
• Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
• Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with, and what is the schedule?
• Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long do you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
• Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
• History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.

Cage Info:

• Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
• Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
• Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
• Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
• Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
• Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high-traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
• Location - Where are you geographically located?

Current Problem -

 

[ColorsOfTheWind]

Thank you for any advice that you have. We have tried to do our research and be as set up as possible but the waiting is hard. I tried to answer everything in as much detail as possible.

• Your Chameleon - Ambilobe Panther Chameleon Egg, Laid 4/17/24. Purchased egg at the end of July from online breeder
• Handling - never
• Feeding - We have 2 producing malanogaster Hydei cultures and 2 producing bean beetle cultures. Have been in production since September. Plan to feed as much as they will eat daily once hatched.
• Supplements -
  • ZooMed ReptiCalcium without D3 for daily dusting
  • Repashy calcium plus LoD twice monthly.
• Watering -
  • Hand Mister -Misting an hour before lights on and an hour after lights off for 60-90 seconds depending on hygrometer readings
  • Fogger running from 9 pm to 5 am.
  • Dripper will be made available for 30-60 minutes twice daily. Will adjust pending chameleon behavior.
• Fecal Description - N/A
• History - expected hatch 10/17/24. Started sweating 11/7/24. Shrunk 11/7-8. Stopped sweating 11/10. No pip. Calcium flaking off exterior.

Cage Info:

• Cage Type - 2x2x4 screen cage.
• Lighting -
  • reptisun R5 HO 8am-8pm.
  • Flukers basking bulb with zilla silver reflective dome 9am-5pm.
  • LED plant light (not sure of brand) 8am-8pm
• Temperature - X-Sense continuous thermometer hygrometer.
  • Daytime - 70.9F-77.4F (mid cage level). Basking 82.0F-87.7F
  • Overnight - 70.5 F-76.8 F. Basking off.
• Humidity - X-Sense thermometer /hygrometer
  • Daytime: 51.2%-67.2%
  • Overnight: 57.6%-93.6%
  • Fogger, mister, dripper, whole room humidifier.
• Plants - Live plants; jade, hibiscus, golden pathos, ornamental passion fruit, Kimberly queen fern, weeping ficus.
• Placement - on a 4 inch stand. They have their own room that will be low traffic. Closed door. Top of the cage is 4.5 ft from floor.
• Location - Detroit, Michigan, US

Current Problem - nervous new mom waiting for egg to hatch. Wants to make sure things are still okay.

Thank you again for any input. Please let me know if anything I am doing sounds off. I know my nighttime could have a bigger temperature drop but as we head into winter the natural temperature drop should help to get that a little lower.

 

[kinyonga]

Where do you keep the container to incubate the egg?
How often have you taken the lid off the container in the last few days…or has it been left on?
Is the container kept in the dark to incubate the egg?

 

[ColorsOfTheWind]

It was being incubated in a dark cabinet but when it started to sweat we moved it out onto the counter and removed the lid. A lot more light as well. Should we put them back in the cabinet with the lid back on?

 

[kinyonga]

The damage may already be done. Leaving the lid off has changed the eco system of the container and allowed the humidity to drop and dry out the egg.

There’s not much chance of you determining whether the baby is still alive or whether the shell has dried out too much for it to cut its way out.
I don’t know what to tell you to do at this point. I hope someone else will jump in on this.

 

[ColorsOfTheWind]

Well thank you for your input. I guess I will hope for the best. Lesson learned. :.(

 

[ColorsOfTheWind]

For the record, I did put the lid back on and put it back in the closet although I know that it may be too late to be of any good. I'm going to give it a little more time and hope for the best. If anyone thinks that there is something better to be done, please let me know.

 

[kinyonga]

This might be worth a read…
http://www.chameleonnews.com/03MarStrand.html

It may be too late to have put the lid back on. I don’t know how long it takes for the baby to suffocate once the egg starts drying out. I do know that it won’t be able to slit the shell if the shell is stiff.

 

[ColorsOfTheWind]

I understand and appreciate all of your help. My husband wants to cut into the shell. I feel like this is a bad idea but I may be wrong. Is opening the shell at this point going to change anything or just risk the small chance that it survived?

 

[Motherlode Chameleon]

I understand and appreciate all of your help. My husband wants to cut into the shell. I feel like this is a bad idea but I may be wrong. Is opening the shell at this point going to change anything or just risk the small chance that it survived?

Assist hatching does work some times. However I recommend to allow the egg to hatch on its own.

I also recommend staying away from buying unhatched eggs. I would just go with breeding and producing your own captive bred or captive hatched clutches.

Best Regards
Jeremy A. Rich

 

[yoteango]

This may not be recommended, but I didn't notice any sweating at this time, but with mine, I noticed the vermiculite was dry, even though the rest of the cups and sponges were wet.
So I put a very small amount of water directly into it, to moisten up the substrate, and he hatched within a few days. It was also a month or so past his due date.