Parasite preventive treatment

kgallego

kgallego

Member
Hey all, if you read my thread earlier you'll know that I've been to the vet today. One of my breeding females suddenly died (or is dying now). I don't have an explanation for it. I'm wondering if there's a chance it was due to some kind of parasite.

Before I ask this question, I'd like to make it clear that I don't want to take all of my cham's to the vet because it's going to cost me $120 for each Cham.

I know there are various types of parasites out there, and they require various types of medicine to treat them. I want to treat my cham's for parasites as a preventative for the majority of common parasites.

Question: what medicines are used and what types of parasites do they treat for?

This is an expert question only. I'm aware that I should have their feces analyzed to determine if/what types of parasites exist. Please don't comment if you so not have experience with this.
 
Here are some files I have collected that provide pictures of parasites, if you are interested in doing your own fecal floats like I am.

This folder contains pictures of Coccidia, Giardia, and Pinworms/Pinworm Eggs (sorted into subfolders respectively).

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/cha8sl40wfob523/1bVbo99ynw

I believe those are the three most common parasites I've seen mentioned here.
 
Thanks guys. It's been a bad day in the chameleon room at my house today. Anything I can learn would be great. I just don't have the biological knowledge.
 
I believe I'll be purchasing a microscope tonight.

Can I get some advice on the best way to examine their feces?

Should I take a sample and add water to it? Do examine the feces and the urate, or both?

What power of maginfication should be enough?

Anything helps. -Thanks-
 
see the video here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ie52cV0OUJw

You need a microscope, Fecal solution, fecalizer device microscope slides and cover slips..


you examine the feces only,,

Direct smears you use saline. Not water.. still need to do a fecal even with a direct smear.. They are good to check for protozoan parasites, not always enough of a sample size to ID or see ova (eggs) or coccidia..

Did you get any sort of exam on the dead cham? Often if parasites a basic physical post mortem will see that.. Doing a smaller animal is not super expensive..
 
Muddyfeet said:
see the video here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ie52cV0OUJw

You need a microscope, Fecal solution, fecalizer device microscope slides and cover slips..


you examine the feces only,,

Direct smears you use saline. Not water.. still need to do a fecal even with a direct smear.. They are good to check for protozoan parasites, not always enough of a sample size to ID or see ova (eggs) or coccidia..

Did you get any sort of exam on the dead cham? Often if parasites a basic physical post mortem will see that.. Doing a smaller animal is not super expensive..
Click to expand...

Wonderful!!! Thank you!!!
 
It is best to have a vet help you with determining a treatment, but it gets expensive especially when they tack on a $70 exotic fee.
I take my fecal samples to a parasitology lab at the vet school I go to. The parasitology lab at my school charges only $9 per sample and the vets would just send it to him anyway and then charge much more. If there is not a vet school close by try to find a diagnostic lab in the area.

Below is a dosage chart for drugs to treat your reptiles
http://www.anapsid.org/resources/rxdose.html

Below is a website that you can purchase the drugs and I have used the company a few times. You can also purchase everything to do your own fecals from this company.
http://www.beautifuldragons.com/Mainstore.html

Hope this helps, but if you have an animal that is very ill then you should take it to a vet. It is very easy to mess up a dosage if you do not know what you are doing and drugs are often toxic if given an excessive dose.
 
Samples have to be fresh.. cannot test old feces..

I request a necropsy myself.. Can be sent to the lab... or heck the herp vet can do one perhaps.. may be really telling even a basic comprehensive visual of the internal structures may lead to some real answers.. Parasites can often be seen by a experienced pathologist on a necropsy..

cost wise? not much more if not less then the stuff needed to run a fecals..

The testing and workup needs to be done on her, her body.. not the healthy animals.. sadly you could be dealing with a possible serious infectious issue.. however when that is the case sometimes testing when a animal is NOT showing symptoms leads to false neg.. MONEY down the drain and will not help prevent a similar outcome in the other animals..

Wormers are kind of safe, but NOT worth killing a delicate animal with just a give in case..
There is not a broad spectrum wormer that will get all worms, cover coccida, giaradia or protozoan..
many are not available in a over the counter med.. will still need a vet to do a exam to issue meds, or give you a script..

worth knowing how to do screening fecals for sure.. get something then get a vet and diagnostic lab to confirm.. but in this case, I really suggest going for a workup on her.. she was lost, but there is a LOT of info one can get post mortem..

as for the speed? well sadly many animals don't go down hill slow.. often its a case, of managing then the final straw..
 
Muddyfeet said:
Samples have to be fresh.. cannot test old feces..

I request a necropsy myself.. Can be sent to the lab... or heck the herp vet can do one perhaps.. may be really telling even a basic comprehensive visual of the internal structures may lead to some real answers.. Parasites can often be seen by a experienced pathologist on a necropsy..

cost wise? not much more if not less then the stuff needed to run a fecals..

The testing and workup needs to be done on her, her body.. not the healthy animals.. sadly you could be dealing with a possible serious infectious issue.. however when that is the case sometimes testing when a animal is NOT showing symptoms leads to false neg.. MONEY down the drain and will not help prevent a similar outcome in the other animals..

Wormers are kind of safe, but NOT worth killing a delicate animal with just a give in case..
There is not a broad spectrum wormer that will get all worms, cover coccida, giaradia or protozoan..
many are not available in a over the counter med.. will still need a vet to do a exam to issue meds, or give you a script..

worth knowing how to do screening fecals for sure.. get something then get a vet and diagnostic lab to confirm.. but in this case, I really suggest going for a workup on her.. she was lost, but there is a LOT of info one can get post mortem..

as for the speed? well sadly many animals don't go down hill slow.. often its a case, of managing then the final straw..
Click to expand...

Thank you for you thoughts.
 
I'm confused. In your previous post, when asked if parasites could have been transferred to your female by a new male when breeding, you said all your animals were parasite free and you have them checked. Now you are asking how to test for parasites. I only ask because this information is pertinent in figuring out what happened to your female. All info is important
 
Djturna4thakidz said:
I'm confused. In your previous post, when asked if parasites could have been transferred to your female by a new male when breeding, you said all your animals were parasite free and you have them checked. Now you are asking how to test for parasites. I only ask because this information is pertinent in figuring out what happened to your female. All info is important
Click to expand...

I had them checked last June, and they were all free of parasites. I'm concerned that something has recently infiltrated my collection.

Here's my thoughts - For the past two years, I have been strictly feeding my cham's insects from my roach, worm, and stick colonies. I never bring insects in with the exception of fruit flies and pinheads to feed the babies. Every time I have had them checked for parasites, they have been free and healthy. About 3 weeks ago, I ordered 1000 pinheads from LLLReptile. They also sent me 1000 medium sized crickets. Instead of just tossing them out, I decided to feed them off. Now all of the sudden I have - what was a perfectly healthy adult Nosy Be female - struggling to survive (she's still alive this morning).

I'm concerned that these crickets my have brought something bad in.

Considering that my collection is always growing, I figured it's time that I learn myself how to examine and treat for parasites, instead of going to the vet and paying a small fortune for it once a year.

Does this clear my situation up a little for you?

Thanks,
Kelsey
 
....I also just purchased a microscope and all the equipment and medication needed to examine and treat for parasites. Everyday I learn something new about these beautiful creatures. I hope I don't have a parasite issue, but if I do, I'm going to find out right away.
 
I still think that it was something really sudden and catastrophic. If you maintain good husbandry and she's in good health I find it much more unlikely that it's something like parasites caused a 2-3 day dramatic decline. If she dies I think I would invest in a neropsy, just to be sure. It may not be anything that your collection is at risk of getting, but we won't know until we know for sure what happened to her.
 
Olimpia said:
I still think that it was something really sudden and catastrophic. If you maintain good husbandry and she's in good health I find it much more unlikely that it's something like parasites caused a 2-3 day dramatic decline. If she dies I think I would invest in a neropsy, just to be sure. It may not be anything that your collection is at risk of getting, but we won't know until we know for sure what happened to her.
Click to expand...

Good point.
 
kgallego said:
Good point.
Click to expand...

Yes, I agree too. If your cham died from complications of a parasite load the gross necropsy may well show you damage from the infestation or adult organisms. If she died from a traumatic injury, rupture etc you should also be able to see that. If nothing is obvious on the necropsy I would start thinking something metabolic, chronic, or a slowly developing issue. That would start me reviewing the husbandry of my breeding females so it doesn't happen again.
 
Cannot stress how important doing a necropsy "if" she dies is..

Did the vet do a fecal?? on her?? In dogs/cats.. last test is ok, but in a sick animal you repeat as possible exposure is a chance.. Parasites are such a huge deal in reptiles, I am kind of surprised it was not part of her workup... and you don't already have at least one run by the vet.. on her..


as for the insect question.. Three weeks.. right? I don't know off the top of my head.. with the reptile parasites.. perhaps a more experienced vet, can comment on what the prepaitent period is on common problematic parasites??

so what "IS" a prepatient period? This is the timeline, point of infection to the point when could see ova.. the point of infection to reproduction of the parasites.. If say you see X and that period is a month, and only been three weeks.. since the insects.. . that is not where they came from.. Sorry..

NOTE.. Correlation, Does not always equal cause.. it can, but often does not..
 
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