Political correctnes gone nuts

[daveo]

So My son is in 4th grade and goes to a K thru 8 school. he and a friend were standing by a poster that is supposed to promote diversity. It shows a bunch of kids from various ethnic origins looking at a drinking fountain. My sons friend says "they are looking at that drinking fountain like they have never seen one before." My son then said, "Well they are Chinese what do you expect?" What my son meant was that he thought that most of the kids in the picture looked Asian and they would be too poor to have ever seen a drinking fountain before. So one of the older kids, A seventh grader who is just a big bully, heard the exchange and told the principal of the school that My son was racist. Based on the comment of some punk seventh grader I now have a big meeting with principal, My son's teacher, and the school councilor. These people are nuts! My son isn't racist! He just does not know that china isn't a third world country. Even then was what he said derogatory? ..I am confused and dismayed.

 

[carol5208]

Well, I could see how it could have been taken the other way too, like they were too dumb to know. You will just have to explain what he meant and hopefully it can get resolved. I know it is a pain in the butt thought!

 

[ChameleonsInMyHouse]

seems like the only ones targeted these days are the innocent. really sorry to hear that though Dave.
If it makes you better, when i was in grade 3, i called a black kid "black beauty" lol (innocently enough, i got a good talk with the principal) but this was back in the day, when bullying wasnt as bad as it is today. parents wern't involved.

hope it all works out, and they dont make your son to feel out to be a bad kid.

screw bullies man, Doyel's never win in the end (billy madison reference)

 

[daveo]

Well, I could see how it could have been taken the other way too, like they were too dumb to know. You will just have to explain what he meant and hopefully it can get resolved. I know it is a pain in the butt thought!

I can see that as well, However my beef is that this is such an issue and they never even asked my son what he meant. My son is a lot of things, but racist isn't one of them. so they just yelled at him and made him cry and now we have to humiliate him in front of Mom and Dad and the teachers. This is insane. As you can tell I am pretty worked up about it.

 

[Zen Reptiles]

This is interesting because it addresses two areas of culture.....racism and the education system.

I do think racism must be squelched at an early age if we are to eliminate it entirely. Racist JOKES are great material and even the worst of them are not as often seen as offensive, but racist comments are not funny and are just plain offensive.....however you will always have the 'righteous' who want to punish any disobedience.

I think your son was leaning more towards the 'joke' end, but I don't know his tone. Young kids, especially girls, can take things from the age of 9 all the way to the age of 29, if your son offended someone about their race, it is serious.

On the other hand, the education system can be a little extreme. Teachers humiliating kids can ruin years of their life, and bullies can do the same. All culminating into a 'lesser' person than what potential was there...it is a terrible thing to see the education system beat kids down psychologically and emotionally. I don't know how many of my friends are so lost now in their mid 20s because of the humiliations and bullying that ruined their younger school days, affecting who they became as men.

Your son's words and the result of them also speak as a valuable lesson to the other kids that any racism is not tolerated....I think that can be the positive taken from this, though at the expense of your own son being the whipping boy. It really doesn't matter what he meant....it matters what it meant to other, more sensitive kids. Hopefully your son will learn empathy and compassion from this, so that he may conduct his words more caringly throughout his life. Thinking before speaking is a very important lesson to learn young.

Your best lesson to teach him from this, is to have a strong constitution, some testicular fortitude, and politely 'take shit' but not let it affect him personally (basically a 'get over it' not a 'woe is me' - that is what will make the difference). He will see how people can be easily offended, and to realize his words can be harmful to other kids, so conduct himself with respect to the feelings of others.

 

[daveo]

...It really doesn't matter what he meant....it matters what it meant to other, more sensitive kids....

I disagree, it always matters what is meant. What is perceived is a different matter altogether. Taking things out of context or not understanding the meaning is what gets many people in trouble. In this case, the boy that over heard the remark was not Asian, or even African American, he was a big white kid who has a history of making my son cry. What is so upsetting to me is that there was no investigation, no follow up. Someone cries Racism and no matter if it is true or not we have to jump all over it or else lawyers will get involved. I remember an incident where some tea party web site posted a snippet of a lady that was in the Obama administration giving a speech and it appeared to be racist. So Obama fired her. It turned out that the speech was taken out of context and she did not make any racist comments. She was only telling her story. Then there was a huge controversy over her termination. I think there was even litigation over it however i may be wrong on that point. Anyway, in that instance the the context and the meaning of what she said was of paramount importance over what was perceived. What you are saying is of course correct in our litigious society, but as a moral argument I completely and utterly disagree.

 

[JackP308]

In this case, the boy that over heard the remark was not Asian, or even African American, he was a big white kid who has a history of making my son cry.

Your son probably meant no harm at all, and it does suck when you don't mean something yet it was still probably said taken out of context and now they're trying to set an example out of him. Hopefully they'll understand when you explain and if not oh well, you know he's not a racist so it shouldn't bother you deep down since thats the truth and you know it. Thats what counts since you know what he meant.


As to the quote what does african americans have anything to do with this?It don't matter who is sitting around listening, we are all people, human. I don't get why people are labeled. I know you probably meant that the kid should never had taken offense in the first place but still it don't matter who's sitting around.

 

[chamguy]

I think he was just makeing an observatoin from the information given in the poster. And besides, the 7th grade student should have been more "mature" about the situation. Your son mostlikely didnt realize that he could offended someone with what he said. In middle school and highschool, worse things are said, and I would consider 7th grade as middleschool.

And in one point, you son is correct. China is not a third world country, but there are lots of poor people, and parts of china. I think that is one reason why education is taken so seriously in that part of the world, also so the country as one can become stronger. There government is also harsh compared to ours.

 

[amanda509]

i know this is a serious issue, but i think kids that young just need to be reprimanded in an understanding manner, not a whole meeting and embarrassing the kid. he didnt know what he said might be offending, so someone needs to explain to him this and go on with their lives. im sorry you have to go through with all this :/

 

[thephotoprincess]

This is interesting because it addresses two areas of culture.....racism and the education system.

I do think racism must be squelched at an early age if we are to eliminate it entirely. Racist JOKES are great material and even the worst of them are not as often seen as offensive, but racist comments are not funny and are just plain offensive.....however you will always have the 'righteous' who want to punish any disobedience.

I think your son was leaning more towards the 'joke' end, but I don't know his tone. Young kids, especially girls, can take things from the age of 9 all the way to the age of 29, if your son offended someone about their race, it is serious.

On the other hand, the education system can be a little extreme. Teachers humiliating kids can ruin years of their life, and bullies can do the same. All culminating into a 'lesser' person than what potential was there...it is a terrible thing to see the education system beat kids down psychologically and emotionally. I don't know how many of my friends are so lost now in their mid 20s because of the humiliations and bullying that ruined their younger school days, affecting who they became as men.

Your son's words and the result of them also speak as a valuable lesson to the other kids that any racism is not tolerated....I think that can be the positive taken from this, though at the expense of your own son being the whipping boy. It really doesn't matter what he meant....it matters what it meant to other, more sensitive kids. Hopefully your son will learn empathy and compassion from this, so that he may conduct his words more caringly throughout his life. Thinking before speaking is a very important lesson to learn young.

Your best lesson to teach him from this, is to have a strong constitution, some testicular fortitude, and politely 'take shit' but not let it affect him personally (basically a 'get over it' not a 'woe is me' - that is what will make the difference). He will see how people can be easily offended, and to realize his words can be harmful to other kids, so conduct himself with respect to the feelings of others.

I disagree, it always matters what is meant. What is perceived is a different matter altogether. Taking things out of context or not understanding the meaning is what gets many people in trouble. In this case, the boy that over heard the remark was not Asian, or even African American, he was a big white kid who has a history of making my son cry. What is so upsetting to me is that there was no investigation, no follow up. Someone cries Racism and no matter if it is true or not we have to jump all over it or else lawyers will get involved. I remember an incident where some tea party web site posted a snippet of a lady that was in the Obama administration giving a speech and it appeared to be racist. So Obama fired her. It turned out that the speech was taken out of context and she did not make any racist comments. She was only telling her story. Then there was a huge controversy over her termination. I think there was even litigation over it however i may be wrong on that point. Anyway, in that instance the the context and the meaning of what she said was of paramount importance over what was perceived. What you are saying is of course correct in our litigious society, but as a moral argument I completely and utterly disagree.

I agree with you Dave and am sorry your son has to deal with this. I find it sad that anyone would tell you to teach your son to "take shit" because god forbid we offend anyone who is "sensitive."

Thank you for reminding me why I homeschooled my kids.

 

[daveo]

...As to the quote what does african americans have anything to do with this?

It has nothing to do with the issue at hand other than I was trying to demonstrate that the kid had no reason to be offended. I was not casting aspersions in any way.

 

[ijmccollum]

I think Zen addresses this quite eloquently.

And as for the mention of a person of color, there was a time in US history that there were segregated drinking fountains based on the color of one's skin - frankly I think the diversity poster is questionable.

 

[Zen Reptiles]

America suffers from harsh racism problems. I think the right steps were taken by the teachers in this case. When it comes to national policy and culture shifts like the abolishment of racism, no it DOES NOT matter what your son meant. Good on the douche bag bully for making an example of him, hopefully 50 other kids will think twice about what they say regarding race in the future.

The important part for the whole has been done. Now the important thing for your son has to be done....which is to teach him how to deal with, and get over things like this that happen in life. People do things because they can, because of a problem within themselves, it has nothing to do with your son. It's cultural, it's personal, it's political, but it's not individual - I hope you show your kid how to see that, and not hold on to things like this.


If you or your kid can't get over this simple mishap......have fun with highschool. I lost friends to suicide because of their stupid 'woe is me' attitude, because they never learned to take shit politely and GET OVER IT. A good F*** YOU, and move on attitude is invaluable. Your son doesn't deserve any special treatment from 'the system'. He deserves guidance and advice from his parent.

Kids need to be guided through experiences like this. Not directed, guided. These are the experiences that shape impressionable minds. The important thing is to get over it and not make a big issue out of nothing. Sensationalism is and easy trap to fall into in America, it's prevalent in EVERYTHING from food to news to issues like this.

It's grade 4, not Jersey Shore. Yes you should take shit politely and move on, don't make an issue out of it like the scum of the earth on TV do. I'm not saying be submissive and passive, that's even worse. Just get over it, plain and simple.

Here's a good couple quotes and songs that got me through the douches of school.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlBiLNN1NhQ

"We are on a minor planet of a very average star located within the outer limits of one of a hundred thousand million galaxies. Are your problems really significant in light of this?"

"Don't worry, life gets better after this.''

You and your son will benefit from reading The Four Agreements by Don Miguel Ruiz.

 

[Zen Reptiles]

For the record, I don't think what your son said was racist, in fact there is a lot of truth to it which I will elaborate on. The setting for it was all wrong though. You can't make comments like that in a school, or around someone who will rat you out. America is trying hard to stop racism and unfortunately your kid is in the crossfire.

China DOES have a disgusting political agenda, unacceptable living standards, terrible environmental laws, and so on and so on and so on and so on. I would say China is the most damaging and backwards nation on the planet, much more so than the West.....despite most of its actions being to provide consumer goods for the West. Racially, the Chinese are great people, but unfortunately the Chinese government has more to do with the Chinese than the Chinese themselves.....

So in that sense, your son is a visionary and would have a case and much evidence for what he said. But the fact remains that racism is serious and in a school setting any remarks on race should not be tolerated.

On a scale of 1-10 on seriousness, what your son said was a 1.


I am white, and I am offended by people who are racist towards Native Americans, Blacks, Asians, and Whites. It is when we are kids that those values are instilled in us, and schools know that. What your son is going through is for the greater good, which is why he should get over it.





I do like to spread the truth, however, and this elaborates on Chinese policy affecting its people much better than I can with words.

******GRAPHIC VIDEO*******

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UqVYUzHc5L8

This is a video of a young Chinese girl being run over. It expands on the point I am making that China has more to do with the Chinese than the Chinese.....

In the video a young girl is run over, the car stops, and continues to run over her and drive off. A dozen people walk right by her in the street, bikes ride past her. Another truck runs over her as if she was simple road kill.

But there is more to the story....in China, if you injure someone, it is basically an honor-system that you must pay for their medical bills for the rest of their life. It makes more economical sense to kill someone in a situation like this, than to take them to the hospital.

Because of Chinese regulations, it leaves no room for people doing the right thing because they could lose everything by being good people.

It was a rag collector, who had nothing to lose, who moved her from the street and then the mother came by.

The ones who are the lowest in society are the only ones free to do the right things.

So in conclusion....your son is right even if he doesn't know all the details. China can be a monster....and not by the choice of the Chinese. But school isn't the place to voice those opinions....much to my disappointment.

 

[daveo]

Zen,

I respect your opinion, however it seems to me that is is an opinion from one who does not have children or has children that are very young. I am not one of those parents that thinks their kid can do no wrong. On the contrary, I believe that kids, ALL kids are selfish, and will Lie cheat and steal any chance they get. It is incumbent on me as a parent to correct these things and teach them that they are not the right thing to do. I can tell you that if I thought for one second that there was some kind of racist thinking going on in my sons head, he would be set straight. I live a very culturally Diverse Neighborhood and racism of any kind will get you killed here. Much easier to just get along with the others. I am not asking for special treatment from the system, I am asking them to let ME parent my child and they need to stay out of it. My philosophy on Fatherhood is that the schools are allowed to teach my kids anything to with academia, However they are to leave the teaching of how to be a good human being up to me. That include religion, political views, and getting along with others. If there is a problem they need to tell me and I will address it. Instead of coming to me on this issue, they had to have all kinds of conferences and meetings and then they had to reprimand my son, then they had to pull me in so they can tell me what a bad parent I am for raising a racist child. This is all insanity. The only reason the teacher acted the way she did was so the scary lawyers won't come down on them. IT IS CRAP! As far as special treatment goes, My wife up until she got Cancer was the Recess attendant for the lunch time and afternoon. She had certain students that were allowed to do things that were plain against the rules. Things like have tantrums and scream and yell names at the staff, then the kids could just go back to what they were doing because little Jimmy has issues so he can disrespect any one he wants and there are no consequences. It is a joke. Little Billy gets suspended for that but little jimmy is special. You know what was special about little jimmy? His mother would routinely come in and berate the staff and threaten to call Lawyers. It is all about getting sued and not doing the right thing. I have a hard telling my son to just shut up and take it when HE DID NOTHING WRONG!

 

[daveo]

Zen Please note that I am in no way angry at you or downplaying your opinion. I am just so frustrated by this whole thing That i may become prejudiced against educators!!! Just Kidding

 

[Seeco]

I think you are totally correct but I advise you just play nice and smile and nod your head -- unless you are 100% gonna tell the people in charge of you kid's education to go F themselves. What I mean by this is don't bother getting into a debate with them. Either go along or find another school. The school is just doing its stupid job.

 

[daveo]

I Know I know, but i would LOVE to tell them where to go!!!

 

[Zen Reptiles]

Yeah but Tenure is on their side lol.

I sure hope Ron Paul wins down there.

He is the only thing in the world that could fix the school system in the States.

 

[Olimpia]

I just watched the video and that is nuts. Reminds me a little of that case up north that is in all the psychology text books nowadays, where a woman was stabbed I don't know how many times between several apartment complexes and it took someone 20 minutes to call 911 because all the people watching assumed someone else had probably already done it. People like to assume that someone else has probably taken care of it. But it's true that the money thing has to be a huge factor for people. Which is, of course, a shame.