possible emergency?

[polkaspot]

I have a pygmy cham that for the past few weeks ive had him has been eating like a champ and running around like crazy untill yesterday when he didnt want to eat and today I found him on the bottom of the cage next to the heat mat. My mom is panicking a bit so I hope to get a quick answer. hes not opening his right eye. He wasnt moving until i put him under my skinks heat bulb and he woke right up so obviously he was cold. I have a zoo med 75w basking spot lamp that I might put on him.
Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - 1 year old pygmy cham
Handling - barely ever
Feeding - gut loaded crickets dusted with calcium d3 havent had him long enough to try anything else. hes been eating 1 bit bigger than quarter inch every other day
Supplements - calcium d3 every other feeding
Watering - misting 2x a day
Fecal Description - havent seen any
History -hes been a champ eater since i bought him, no problems until now

Cage Info:
Cage Type -5gal terrarium screen top, i was told pygmys do better in terrariums than screen cages
Lighting - doh i cant find the box but its a uva exo terra bulb it was a low wattage and it gives off almost no heat
Temperature - 65-75 he had one heat mat i added the second just now
Humidity - havent gotten a gauge yet but he gets misted 2x a day and has moss to hold the humidity
Plants - fake vine and one fake suction cup plant, live earth star plant
Placement - in my dining room away from activity, windows, drafts ect
Location - long island, new york

 

[DrRhymes]

Is it possible to post some pictures? I am not to familiar with pygmies but have you seen anything that he has not supposed to be eating in his mouth. Does he look hydrated(sunken eyes)?

 

[polkaspot]

His eyes are closed now but they didnt look sunken in when i put him under the skinks light. Im charging up the dslr to get a good pic of those tiny eyeballs. ill have one in a few minutes. Should I have a water bowl in with him? i was planning on buying a little dripper tomorrow

 

[ChameleonMom]

I am not a pygmie cham keeper nor am I very familiar with this species but I don't see any mention of a UVB bulb in your husbandry. ALL chameleons need UVB light to produce the proper amount of D3 in their bodies - without it they develop Metabolic Bone Disease (MBD) and become crippled, break their legs and eventually die. I also note that you are only dusting with Calcium w/D3 so if he doesn't have the light, he's not able to metabolise the D3 like he needs to. I am concerned this is what may be ailing your little guy. It isn't reversable but it can be stopped however, it is URGENT that you purchase a UVB bulb (I use a Repti-Sun 5.0/26W UVB coil bulb) as soon as possible.

I have also noted that you have substrate in the bottom of your enclosure. Again, I am not experienced with pygmie's but I know in general substrate is a big NO NO in cham cages. If they ingest any foreign objects they can easily become impacted and cause major problems that will require veterinary care.

Of course, anything I am telling you is not to be taken in place of veterinarian care - if you are truly concerned and it appears he's not doing well, please get him to a vet asap as they will be able to tell you precisely what is wrong with him and provide meds if required.

Good luck.

 

[polkaspot]

O im like 95% sure thats the bulb i bought i just looked it up. Its a coil and thats the only bulb I've ever seen that goes by 26w I remember that. This is him 5 mins ago sleeping on his plant. If anything looks off let me know please. Thanks for the help I appreciate it..

 

[ferretinmyshoes]

Polkaspot - do not add a water bowl, and I don't have a dripper for any of my pygmies. Misting is enough as long as water droplets collect on leaves of the plants and the leaf litter on the ground. Some of mine prefer to drink from upright plants and some prefer to go down to the ground and drink off the leaf litter puddles. Your temperatures sound good and your humidity is probably okay with two mistings a day. My pygs have gotten down into the 50s and are still active so it is highly unlikely that he was actually cold. He was probably just responding to you picking him up and trying to look alive enough that you wouldn't eat him (in his mind). I do not supplement more than once a week unless they're babies, and sometimes less.

I don't think you should have a heat mat in the cage at all. Chameleons do not bask on rocks like other lizards do they are poorly adapted to having heat from below and can easily burn themselves on that type of heat source. They will do poorly and can even perish if temperatures get over 80 degrees so I would not use a 75w bulb over him!

His eyes do look sunken in the picture. When did you get him and from where? Most all pygmies are available as wild caught chameleons so unfortunately their actual age is often not known and their lifespan is fairly short at only 2-3 years. So if he was wild caught you don't know if he is nearing the end of lifespan naturally. Sometimes crickets left in the cage at night will nibble on chameleons and I have seen a Pygmy with a chewed up eye from crickets. Does it look injured at all?

That you found him on the ground is not very concerning as long as he was sitting up like normal. This is different from normal chameleon species because pygmies often spend time on the ground. I have a female who is almost always on the ground and rarely goes up into the plants. Every so often one of mine will close their eye for some reason - I increase mistings and actually spray them directly, especially on the side of the closed eye. Not a lot, just enough to moisten the eye. That usually resolves it for me and I attribute it to some irritation from dust or dirt in their eye. I would try that tomorrow and see if that helps. Plus it will hopefully encourage to drink better since he looks dehydrated.

Pygmies are delicate and unfortunately there is not a lot we can do for them when they become I'll because handling is stressful enough for them to make it worse and diagnostics are extremely limited due to their small size.

ChameleonMom - you are spot on for normal chameleon species, however pygmies break all the rules! UVB is actually not needed. I provide it to mine but there is no evidence to support that they actually utilize UVB since they normally live in the shaded lowest levels of the forest. I have raised pyg babies with no UVB whatsoever and they did fantastically. I still chose to provide it to mine in low levels. So that is not the problem. And substrate is usually used in pyg terrariums since pygs do spend time on the ground. It's more important for females to have a planted cage, but even with males I provide substrate. Impaction can still happen however. Like I said, pygs break all the rules of normal chameleon care.

 

[lausnordah]

have you compared what you're doing as far as environment to the pygmy care sheet?

not an expert but i think that chameleon looks dehydrated - all the chameleon eyes i've seen don't look like they have eye liner on them

that cham doesn't appear to have full turrets.

i mist my chameleons 4-5 times a day for 3 minutes each misting to give them time to drink/raise humidity. i let my cage dry out between mistings, but i have a panther and a graceful - pygmy might be different

i have one cham who runs from the mist and doesn't drink so i have a dripper for him.

just get a cup or a plastic container and poke a hole in the bottom with a thumb tack and let it drip onto a leaf. don't let standing water collect at the bottom of the cage.

NO WATER BOWLS.

 

[polkaspot]

So could I put a zoo med 25w basking spot lamp on him? and ill mist him for a bit longer

 

[vydalbabi]

I am not familiar with pygmies but that chameleon looks super dehydrated to me. Have you seen it drink any water in the last few days? I would say you should definitely try to get it some water. Again I dont know about pygmies but when my panthers are being stubborn and dont want to drink I give them hornworms or gutload my feeders with lots of wet foods. But if you havent offered it water by misting long enough or dripping that will probably get him to drink right away. I would say mist at least 3 minutes because sometimes it takes them a little while to notice the water. Hope this helps and hope your little guy gets better soon

 

[vydalbabi]

Oh and mine really like when you mist with warm water

 

[polkaspot]

Ok thanks a lot everyone I have the heating mat on the side of the cage rather than the bottom so hes not sitting on it. I think I might try the dripper just because I've never seen him go for the water when I spray him and if hes dehydrated id rather him have constant water all day at least till hes better. o and i got him from a reptile store by me. They told me he was a year old and was cb.

 

[ChameleonMom]

ChameleonMom - you are spot on for normal chameleon species, however pygmies break all the rules! UVB is actually not needed. I provide it to mine but there is no evidence to support that they actually utilize UVB since they normally live in the shaded lowest levels of the forest. I have raised pyg babies with no UVB whatsoever and they did fantastically. I still chose to provide it to mine in low levels. So that is not the problem. And substrate is usually used in pyg terrariums since pygs do spend time on the ground. It's more important for females to have a planted cage, but even with males I provide substrate. Impaction can still happen however. Like I said, pygs break all the rules of normal chameleon care.

I am so happy that you chimed in on this thread ferret! As I mentioned I am not experienced with pygmies but felt the basics would be the same. I am glad that I have learned something about them, and now that I am interested in their quirky requirements I intend to do some reading. Teach me to speak up when I didn't have the proper knowledge! I'd hate to think my misinformation could cause greater problems. Lesson learned.