Rep Cal questions.

[apondozzi]

Just wondering what people think about rep-cal stuff, I got rep-cal and herbivite and it says on the containers to mix them 1:1. is that recommended for a six month old ambilobe? How often should the multi-vitamin and calcium with d3 be used? I've read 1-2 times a month but does that mean for the entire day of feeding or just 1-2 feeders? also, what is a good calcium without d3? I'm worrying about overdosing my chameleon with these supplements and this forum is the only thing I trust as far as getting sufficient information on these issues to make an educated decision as far as what I do. Thanks so much.

 

[VeiledOwner87]

Just wondering what people think about rep-cal stuff, I got rep-cal and herbivite and it says on the containers to mix them 1:1. is that recommended for a six month old ambilobe? How often should the multi-vitamin and calcium with d3 be used? I've read 1-2 times a month but does that mean for the entire day of feeding or just 1-2 feeders? also, what is a good calcium without d3? I'm worrying about overdosing my chameleon with these supplements and this forum is the only thing I trust as far as getting sufficient information on these issues to make an educated decision as far as what I do. Thanks so much.

imo it all boils down to your gutload. with a constant balance of dry foods (oats, bee pollen, etc) to your commercial dry gut loads (cricket crack, i use flucker's), along with fresh fruits and veggies, there might not even be a need to suppliment your feeders once or twice a month with multivitamins. it is your own preference. some keepers choose not suppliment at all due to their knowledge of hypovitaminosis. there are sometimes where i cannot provide the time to make a gut load salad. so i still suppliment multivitam (very lightly) once or twice. my schedual is twice one month, once the next to balance it out to about 1 suppliment every 3 or so weeks.

when i dust, i dust all feeders (crickets only for this) and again very light dust. the multivitamin i use is the Exo-Terra brand, untill this supply runs out, i will then switch to Rep-cal herptivite. either way, be careful when choosing your brand. I feel alot more content using a product with Beta-Carotene source for vitamin A, too much vitamin A will just destroy the liver, Beta-Carotene is well and safe.

For all my other suppliments, i use Rep-cal Calcium with and without Vitamin D3, they are both phosphorus free products. from what i know, there has to be a good balance of phosphorus:calcium ratio, and i believe your phosphorus is found in your feeders and gutloads. .... i think. i havent realy read up on that part lol.

but i hope this helps, again, it is all my opinion, and almost everything ive picked up with experience and help from the experts here on the forums. just here to give a ball park idea, i hope more can add to this.,

 

[pssh]

I use the repcal brand, and I only use the vitamins once a months (and every now and then I skip a month because I'm confident in my gutload.) I also use the d3 twice a month and not at all if my chameleons recieve lots of unfiltered sunlight. I always dust crickets and roaches with calcium without d3 though. Just make sure the bugs are lightly dusted and your gutload is rich in vitamins and calcium. Use a variety of different greens like kale, collards, dandelion greens, endive, escarole, and maybe some celery leaves. Add some other veggies like squash, sweet pepper, sweet potatoes, and carrots. Add a fuit or two if you want also, like papaya, oranges, raspberries, blue berries, strawberries, and apple. Don't forget a good dry gutload like cricket crack.

Personally, I like to blend all the dry and wet gutload together and just feed it to the bugs in scoops. Just make sure there is fruit in it or they won't eat any.

 

[sandrachameleon]

Just wondering what people think about rep-cal stuff, I got rep-cal and herbivite and it says on the containers to mix them 1:1. is that recommended for a six month old ambilobe? How often should the multi-vitamin and calcium with d3 be used? I've read 1-2 times a month but does that mean for the entire day of feeding or just 1-2 feeders? also, what is a good calcium without d3? I'm worrying about overdosing my chameleon with these supplements and this forum is the only thing I trust as far as getting sufficient information on these issues to make an educated decision as far as what I do. Thanks so much.

Despite what it says, dont mix.
Use the plain calcium most, and the D3 and Vits less often. No one can tell you specifically how much to use, because no one else is in exactly the same situation. We dont know how often (if at all) your chameleon will be exposed to the outdoors (to natural light). We dont know what you are gutloading with. We dont know what mix of prey you are offering (some needs dusting, others dont).

What I do is dust ALL crickets with a light amount of calcium. I sometimes dust supers as well. I dont dust most other prey items at all. I do pay attention to gutloading, mostly fresh fruit and veg that is higher in calcium than phos. I use the vitamin supplement every other week, on a couple of the feeders. I use the D3 the opposite weeks, again on only a couple of the feeders.

VeiledOwner87 and pssh are correct in saying your gutload is key. check this blog entry for info on gutloading: https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/sandrachameleon/75-feeder-nutrition-gutloading.html

You may find this blog entry about supplementing useful:
https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/sandrachameleon/65-supplements.html

 

[apondozzi]

Well I've only had him for about six days now but I havnt taken him outside for natural uv yet... Didn't know it was absolutely necessary. The crickets from what I was told at a local store were gutloaded, don't know with what... It is a store that has other reptiles so obviously the more common greens or at least prepackaged cricket food. So far I have only fed him crickets but am planning on getting some silk or horn worms, even though I'm pretty sure crickets have a higher calcium to phosphate ratio anyways. I thought that most feeders were higher in phosphates and chams need calcium, especially when they are juveniles to grow strong bones. That's why you want to compensate with the calcium right? But I will definitely try throwing in some fruits and veg into the cricket depository. Thank you for the feedback everyone. It's discouraging sometimes with all the whack misinformation that the producers put out. I'm glad there are people out there who care enough to share their experiences and advice.

 

[apondozzi]

Also I have a reptiglo 5 linear Uvb bulb and a 70 watt basking bulb. and the basking temp is right under 90 the cooler areas of the viv get around 70. Is my cham getting less UVB because it passes through the top of the screened enclosure? If so, wouldn't it make more sense to use a 10?
What other feeders would you recommend for a 6 month old male blue bar ambilobe? I was thinking silkworms and crickets would be sufficient now and as he grows maybe the ocassional super or meal worm. Thank you for the links very interesting.

 

[apondozzi]

*5 month old

 

[kinyonga]

You said..."Just wondering what people think about rep-cal stuff"...I have used it for years and I'm happy with it.

You said..."I got rep-cal and herbivite and it says on the containers to mix them 1:1. is that recommended for a six month old ambilobe? How often should the multi-vitamin and calcium with d3 be used? I've read 1-2 times a month but does that mean for the entire day of feeding or just 1-2 feeders? also, what is a good calcium without d3? I'm worrying about overdosing my chameleon with these supplements and this forum is the only thing I trust as far as getting sufficient information on these issues to make an educated decision as far as what I do"...I will explain what I do below and why.

I dust with Rep-cal calcium at most feedings to help make up for the usually poor ratio of calcium to phos. found in most feeder insects. (I do this for all ages...babies get fed more often so they get it more often that way).

You said..."I havnt taken him outside for natural uv yet... Didn't know it was absolutely necessary"...it isn't absolutely necessary. Mine rarely get outside since I live in Canada....and they live long healthy lives.

I dust twice a month lightly with Rep-cal with D3 to ensure that the chameleon gets some without overdoing it. I leave them to produce the rest through their exposure to UVB. D3 from supplements can build up in the system and lead to health issues....UVB from the sun or a UVB light should not cause any problems as long as the chameleon can move in and out of the UVB.

I dust twice a month with Herptivite. It contains beta carotene (prOformed) as a source of vitamin A which won't build up in the chameleon's system, but its controversial as to whether it can be converted by all/any chameleons so some people give a little prEformed vitamin A too. Excess prEformed vitamin A may prevent the D3 from doing its job and push the chameleon towards MBD...so be careful with it.

Phosphorus, calcium, D3 and vitamin A are all important players in bone health and need to be in balance. When trying to balance them you need to look at the supplements, what you feed the chameleon and what you feed the insects.

I gutload crickets and superworms with a wide variety of greens (dandelions, kale, collards, endive, escarole, mustard greens, etc.) and veggies (carrots, squash, sweet potato, sweet red pepper, zucchini, celery leaves, etc.).

Hope this makes it clearer!

 

[Clifford]

Well I've only had him for about six days now but I havnt taken him outside for natural uv yet... Didn't know it was absolutely necessary.

Its not necessary. My guy never goes outside and he is fine. I use the Repcal D3 product about twice a month. If he went outside, I may give him less D3 supplement or use a supplement brand that had less in it.

though I'm pretty sure crickets have a higher calcium to phosphate ratio anyways

just the opposite, crickets have the wrong calicum to phos ratio. thats why we supplement with calcium dust (and gutload)

 

[apondozzi]

just the opposite, crickets have the wrong calicum to phos ratio. thats why we supplement with calcium dust (and gutload)

yes I'm aware that most feeders are higher in phosphates unless gutloaded with proper foods that's why calcium supplementation is sometimes necessary. I was only trying to say that crickets are supposedly more nutritious than most other feeders I think with the exception of pinkies. At least that's what I have read.

I have since started feeding my crickets a mix of strawberries and cricket crack. We always have a variety of fruits and veg, any particularly bad ones for a Cham? I've heard broccoli is to be avoided. Also Baxter seems to love wax worms, should I be dusting them or strictly crickets? Because I feel like he's kind of over crickets for the time being. Didn't go for them at all today, but gobbled up four wax worms in about two minutes!

 

[kinyonga]

Its the calcium to phosphorous ratio you are referring to in the insects...not phosphate.

Crickets are a good insect to use as a feeder because they can be easily gutloaded with the nutrients you want to get into your chameleon...but variety is still a good thing.

I don't ever feed pinkies to my chameleons....and they live long healthy lives as a rule.

 

[sandrachameleon]

Skip the pinkies, skip the waxworms. Both are blobs of fat.

go with (gutloaded and dusted) crickets, silkworms, roaches, indian walking stick insects, terrestrial isopods (aka pillbugs, rollie pollie, wood sow), butterworms, superworms (gutloaded), moths...

 

[apondozzi]

I wanted silkworms or roaches but my local spot only had mealworms and wax worms, thought that wax worms were supposed to be better. i guess i was wrong. at least i can harvest some wax moths. those are good to feed on the daily, right?

 

[sandrachameleon]

I wouldnt use mealworms more than max once a week. I would not use waxworms at all, or hardly at all. Moths are not nutritious enough to use daily, I treat them like treats (once a month).

You can buy bugs online if you cant get them at your local shops:
A few of the many online Insect suppliers

Canada
www.canadianfeeders.ca
www.feederfactory.ca
www.westcoastdragons.ca/FeederPriceList.html
www.bcbugs.com
www.trinitychameleons.com
www.bugorder.com
www.recorpinc.com/index.html
www.portcreditpets.com/feeders.html
www.scaryguysexoticpets.com/feeders.html

UK
http://www.butterworms.co.uk
http://www.roachshop.co.uk/
www.livefoodsdirect.co.uk
http://www.silkwormstore.co.uk/

USA
http://www.stflies.com/
http://www.mulberryfarms.com/
http://www.nilesbio.com/prod95.html
http://www.greatlakeshornworm.com/
http://coastalsilkworms.com/splash.html
http://www.forkedtreeranch.com/prices.htm
http://www.ghann.com/
http://www.carolina.com/category/living+organisms/animals.do?sortby=ourPicks
www.joshsfrogs.com
www.theroachranch.com


and dont forget to check the site sponsors and the classfieds on this forum https://www.chameleonforums.com/miscellaneous-sale/
Here is a list of most of the commonly used feeders, and info about each: https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/sandrachameleon/74-feeders.html