This is Super Weird-check this out!

[Julirs]

This morning I switched on all the lights to all the cham cages, and then came back about 20 minutes later to water everyone. I find my younger female Oustalet on her branch but leaning on the screen with her mouth open and tongue hanging slightly out. I checked her airway and it was clear, there is no outward sign of trauma, she ate and drank yesterday as normal. She is WC, so there could be a million issues, but I have had her since March and all has been well-she was a healthy little chameleon. SO-for about a half hour her tongue starts coming out a little more, she does the big open mouth thing that chams do when they are dieing, I consult the experts, and I lay her on papertowel, tongue hanging out a good way (so I moistened with water), and left for a meeting fully expecting her to be dead upon my return. A few hours later my kids call to tell me she is up and looking around. I say WHAT? IS HER TONGUE IN? And when I got home she is upright on the papertowel, normal colors, tongue in, looking around. She has not gone back up into her plants and vines yet, so I doubt we are even close to out of the woods here. WHAT IN THE WORLD????? Past clean fecal, no past issues. I am at a loss. I thought for sure she was a goner (she still may be), but this is TOO WEIRD.

 

[kinyonga]

Have you provided her with a place to lay eggs?

 

[Julirs]

Yes-all my females have places to lay eggs. She has a large potted Pothos in which to dig, and I do not feel any eggs.

 

[opihiman]

would this be better in the "health clinic" section?

 

[Julirs]

would this be better in the "health clinic" section?

Yes actually it should, I apologize as I was in a panic.

 

[opihiman]

No need to be sorry...just wanted to make sure you get the help you are looking for.

the other member will also want more info:

Cage Info:
Cage Type - What kind of cage are you using? What is the size?
Lighting - What kind of lighting are you using? How long do you keep the lights on during the day?
Temperature - What temperature range have you created? Basking spot temp? What is the temperature at night?
Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels?
Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
Location - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas?

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon.
Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What kind of schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
Supplements - What are you dusting your feeders with and what kind of schedule do you use?
Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings.
History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.
Current Problem - The current problem that you are concerned about.

Pictures if possible too?

Hope you get the answers you are looking for?

good luck

OPI

 

[Julirs]

After a million times that I have copied and pasted the questions!

Cage Info:
Cage Type - What kind of cage are you using? What is the size? 38 gallon Reptarium
Lighting - What kind of lighting are you using? How long do you keep the lights on during the day? Zoomed Reptisun 5.0 12 hours and a 75 Watt lightbulb for basking
Temperature - What temperature range have you created? Basking spot temp? What is the temperature at night? Basking temp is 90 degrees rest of cage is ambient room at 74.
Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? 40-60 depending on misting-living in Florida makes things wonderful...
Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind? Live Pothos
Location - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? Family room, low traffic

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. WC Oustalet approx 5-6 months old
Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What kind of schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders? Crickets, roaches, silkies gutloaded with Coastal Silkworms roach coach and fresh veggies
Supplements - What are you dusting your feeders with and what kind of schedule do you use? 5X weekly light Repcal no D3, 2X monthly with D3, 2X monthly Herptivite
Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? Do you see your chameleon drinking? Misting 3X daily
Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Normal
History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you. Negative fecal after arrival
Current Problem - The current problem that you are concerned about. See above

Pictures if possible too? Taken yesterday

Hope you get the answers you are looking for?

 

[ken2414]

I think I know the answer you are looking for:

Hyperextension of the tongue.

It happens when a chameleon strikes a prey item and the tongue fails to return to the mouth. this could of happened when she was eating or drinking

 

[Julirs]

I think I know the answer you are looking for:

Hyperextension of the tongue.

It happens when a chameleon strikes a prey item and the tongue fails to return to the mouth. this could of happened when she was eating or drinking

Well, I have actually experienced hyperextension, and this is very unlike that. In hyperextention cases, the chameleon does not lie on its side looking dead. I had not fed or watered her before I found her like I did.

I have actually heard from several people with years of experience and all seem baffled. She is still sitting on the bottom and it looks like she is making an attempt to climb up into her plants.

I guess I should also clarify that she became more "limp" after I found her, and she was not at all attempting to stand or support her weight. I laid her on her side on the papertowel before I left with her tongue hanging out.

 

[AFH]

After a million times that I have copied and pasted the questions!

Ha ha Juli, BUSTED!!!!

Glad to hear she's doing better. That is super weird. Maybe you've got one that is a super deep sleeper. You know, some call sleep "small death".

 

[opihiman]

Just stopping back to see how you Cham is doing...has he/she perked up more? or still just chilling mid cage? How is the tongue issue?

OPI-

 

[SoCaliSon]

Juli... This has got to bugging you! I am scratching my head on this end. One thing is for sure... it does sound serious for this girl.

I have been tossing ideas around for about 30 mins now... and all I can come up with is...

I once had 2 healthy pet rats that suddenly died in the night. This is a random shot in the dark, and have yet to hear about it happening to Chams... But have you noticed any spiders or other kind of bug roaming the area that might have gotten in her cage. When we couldn't find out what happened to my rats... the vet shaved both and found identical bites, the vet said had come from some sort of spider, scary thing is I never found the spider. I am wondering if she didn't get bit, maybe she ate a bug that made it's way into her cage and had a bad reaction from it. How is that for pulling a thought out of left field.. Only reason I bring it up as one of the many possiblities is because of personally having caged pets die this way.

Another thought... Having personally almost died from a random happenstance that was considered a "congenital defect", after being totally healthy my whole life... Maybe she has somekind of congenital issue that is starting to surface. It is always a possiblilty she was just an unlucky girl and is suffering from something out of your power. I ahve a feeling something like that is the case.

Best of Luck Juli, Must be something in the air... It has been a wierd week!

~Joe

 

[Chameleons Northwest]

A brain seizure? Kristina has experienced chams with seizures, but I think there was a lot of random movement. I do know that humans can experience seizures that cause them to just slump into a semi-conscious state. Do chameleons have strokes?

 

[ken2414]

with the hyperextension comment i was reffering to the tongue.

 

[Chameleons Northwest]

Socalison has a point. Perhaps a one-time allergic reaction. That's what I hope it is.

 

[Julirs]

with the hyperextension comment i was reffering to the tongue.

Thanks ken2414-I knew that you were referring to the tongue.

UPDATE-She has climbed up into her sleeping spot, slowly, but she has made it up there. I have left her alone for the day, and we shall see what tomorrow brings. Seizure or stroke would make sense-she was in a catatonic state when I found her, and her movements now are very calculated and slow. Just now as I was typing I noticed she was licking the screen so I misted it a bit, poor girl is thirsty. None of my Outalets likes to be misted directly, they all lick water off the leaves.

 

[Julirs]

Juli... This has got to bugging you! I am scratching my head on this end. One thing is for sure... it does sound serious for this girl.

I have been tossing ideas around for about 30 mins now... and all I can come up with is...

I once had 2 healthy pet rats that suddenly died in the night. This is a random shot in the dark, and have yet to hear about it happening to Chams... But have you noticed any spiders or other kind of bug roaming the area that might have gotten in her cage. When we couldn't find out what happened to my rats... the vet shaved both and found identical bites, the vet said had come from some sort of spider, scary thing is I never found the spider. I am wondering if she didn't get bit, maybe she ate a bug that made it's way into her cage and had a bad reaction from it. How is that for pulling a thought out of left field.. Only reason I bring it up as one of the many possiblities is because of personally having caged pets die this way.

Another thought... Having personally almost died from a random happenstance that was considered a "congenital defect", after being totally healthy my whole life... Maybe she has somekind of congenital issue that is starting to surface. It is always a possiblilty she was just an unlucky girl and is suffering from something out of your power. I ahve a feeling something like that is the case.

Best of Luck Juli, Must be something in the air... It has been a wierd week!

~Joe

Hmmmmm-now I am creeped out. I have tons of spiders here (It's Florida) but nothing to my knowledge that is poisonous. Since I am keeping so many crickets, I do find tiny spiders and some not so tiny ones in the house, even hatching egg cases! Not sure that is something I can stop here. I vacuum alot! Maybe I am wrong, but if it caused her to act like she did (near death) it seems if it were a poisonous spider she would for sure be dead. I do have a nice scoop of flesh out of my lower leg from a brown recluse from when I lived in Indiana!

 

[SoCaliSon]

Hmmmmm-now I am creeped out. I have tons of spiders here (It's Florida) but nothing to my knowledge that is poisonous. Since I am keeping so many crickets, I do find tiny spiders and some not so tiny ones in the house, even hatching egg cases! Not sure that is something I can stop here. I vacuum alot! Maybe I am wrong, but if it caused her to act like she did (near death) it seems if it were a poisonous spider she would for sure be dead. I do have a nice scoop of flesh out of my lower leg from a brown recluse from when I lived in Inidana!

I am so glad that you are here to tell us about your brown recluse incident... That is one of the worst spiders to get bit by. I don't want to worry you... But just thought I would bring it up as one of many possibilities even though I have never heard of it happening with Chams. As far as wat to do with spiders... I think it was Kent that had mentioned before about getting a couple house Geckos and letting them free range your house.... To me that sounds like a killer idea. I recommended this to a friend of mine who kept waking up with spider bites after cleaning out her bed several times. We are looking to get a couple for her to try this out.

Personally, Speculation of course, this sounds like a natural occurance inside her body. If I had to vote for one it would be Gesangs thought... Stroke or something of the sorts. But I am no Vet...

~Joe

 

[AFH]

Check out Chris Anderson's latest post. There are strange cham things afoot...

 

[spatulars]

She's so pretty, I hope she'll be feeling better tomorrow.