What chameleons are best to start breeding?

[CamoChameleonsHuman]

I keep juvenile geckos in 12x12x18 and they are smaller than the palm of my hand tail included. 18x18x36 is smallest I would ever recommend any veild, panther, Jackson start in. Females can live comfortably in that size their whole lives but benefit from a 2x2x4. 2x2x4 is bare bare minimum if you ask me for an adult male veiled or panther.

 

[Ruthless]

I’m sorry but to be brutally honest you are not ready for this hobby or responsibility’s that come along with it. I have gone through the last 3 pages and most of them talk about your lack of cash. That is a big issue as many have said,”this is a expensive hobby “. And you say you have done tons of research but then in your last few posts you talk about getting the smallest cage one can buy and even that’s too small. What are you researching maybe you need to take a few steps back and realize this hobby can become a very expensive one. If the amount that it’s going to cost you is your biggest concern, it’s not for you right now.

 

[Daesie11]

Definetly getting a male panther since my dad likes holding my pets alot even when I tell him not to and I got a 10-15 gallon tank (that I will use until my panther is too big for it and I plan to get a job over the summer and get 600-1000 dollars to be able to get the suppplies needed. I have a little dripper and some irragation tubes (I think thats what its for but I'm not sure) I also have a cricket cage setup already for my bearded dragon but I plan on mabye expanding It

You've been very receptive to everyone's advise so far, so please keep listening.
First, as everyone has stated, the cage you have now is not going to work for you. It's way too small, even for a baby cham. They grow VERY fast and that small of an enclosure will not work, even if it was free.
I understand that you want to get this cham and you are excited, but you need to get everything you need BEFORE the cham. If that means waiting until after summer when you've made your money, then as a responsible keeper (and person in general) that's what you need to do.
Finally, and I dont think a lot of people have pointed this out, if your father is incapable of respecting the boundaries of your pets enough to NOT handle them when they dont want to be handled, then maybe having a chameleon when you are still living at home isnt the best idea. Handling can cause a. Lot of stress for chameleons, and continued, constant stress can and will eventually kill them.
I know you clearly want to have a cham, and I understand, they are beautiful and fascinating creatures. But if you really love them like we all do here, then you need to take all these things in to consideration. Being a responsible adult sometimes means putting the needs of others (including and especially animals) before the needs/wants of yourself. Like I said in the beginning, you've been very receptive and understanding for everything weve told you up until this point which is very demonstrative of your personality, so I think you'll make the right choice here. And I also think down the road when you are completely ready you will make a great keeper.

 

[FloodedYeti]

Honestly, no. 12x12x18 is way too small, even for a young panther. 16x16x30 minimum to start off, but it is much better to start with the full size 24"x24"x48" enclosure. If you cannot afford or provide this, then it is best you wait until you save up money before purchasing an animal.

I'm looking at FL extreme large package or something comes with misting and is 2x2x4 and a bunch of other supplies

 

[FloodedYeti]

I’m sorry but to be brutally honest you are not ready for this hobby or responsibility’s that come along with it. I have gone through the last 3 pages and most of them talk about your lack of cash. That is a big issue as many have said,”this is a expensive hobby “. And you say you have done tons of research but then in your last few posts you talk about getting the smallest cage one can buy and even that’s too small. What are you researching maybe you need to take a few steps back and realize this hobby can become a very expensive one. If the amount that it’s going to cost you is your biggest concern, it’s not for you right now.

I never said anything about lack of cash I'm getting a job and at $10 an hour and at part time I can get over $1000 in a month if I work 6 days a week

 

[Chameleomom]

I never said anything about lack of cash I'm getting a job and at $10 an hour and at part time I can get over $1000 in a month if I work 6 days a week

This is the tip of the iceberg for just the cage and stuff to get you started

 

[FloodedYeti]

I never said anything about lack of cash I'm getting a job and at $10 an hour and at part time I can get over $1000 in a month if I work 6 days a week

You've been very receptive to everyone's advise so far, so please keep listening.
First, as everyone has stated, the cage you have now is not going to work for you. It's way too small, even for a baby cham. They grow VERY fast and that small of an enclosure will not work, even if it was free.
I understand that you want to get this cham and you are excited, but you need to get everything you need BEFORE the cham. If that means waiting until after summer when you've made your money, then as a responsible keeper (and person in general) that's what you need to do.
Finally, and I dont think a lot of people have pointed this out, if your father is incapable of respecting the boundaries of your pets enough to NOT handle them when they dont want to be handled, then maybe having a chameleon when you are still living at home isnt the best idea. Handling can cause a. Lot of stress for chameleons, and continued, constant stress can and will eventually kill them.
I know you clearly want to have a cham, and I understand, they are beautiful and fascinating creatures. But if you really love them like we all do here, then you need to take all these things in to consideration. Being a responsible adult sometimes means putting the needs of others (including and especially animals) before the needs/wants of yourself. Like I said in the beginning, you've been very receptive and understanding for everything weve told you up until this point which is very demonstrative of your personality, so I think you'll make the right choice here. And I also think down the road when you are completely ready you will make a great keeper.

I'm probably going to get it (or at least the cage and supplies depending on how long shipping is (probably the FLchams extreme large package/ cage with all the supplies but I'm still looking to see if its enough or if I need to get more since packages are usually don't have everything) by a week before the end of the summer since with pets the first week is always the hardest or I might work out a deal where I get the supplies soon and get a job and pay them off as I work and I can see if my mom will work with my dad on handling

 

[Beman]

I'm looking at FL extreme large package or something comes with misting and is 2x2x4 and a bunch of other supplies

That package is sub par... I mean it it ok but really not the best. the hood isnt even a 24 inch fixture. I would buy your set up in pieces and find the best prices.

 

[FloodedYeti]

That package is sub par... I mean it it ok but really not the best. the hood isnt even a 24 inch fixture. I would buy your set up in pieces and find the best prices.

Yeah made a new forum asking about it I'm probably gonna use It as a kind-of guide for what to buy

 

[KobaOregonherper]

I never said anything about lack of cash I'm getting a job and at $10 an hour and at part time I can get over $1000 in a month if I work 6 days a week

At partime your looking at around 600 a month for 10$ hour after taxes my dude. But regardless. You really to look into all the things your going to need. Most kits are garbage. Watch more youtube videos and go through the lages here for thenright items youll need. This is not an inexpenisve endeavour, and is do able. As for the breeding, give it some time. If you still want to do it after owning your cham for a long while and you can do it successfully, then go for it. Just keeping then alive is not successful. If you cant provide proper heat, uvb, and humidity, your adult might deal with it, but those little babies will die.

 

[FloodedYeti]

At partime your looking at around 600 a month for 10$ hour after taxes my dude. But regardless. You really to look into all the things your going to need. Most kits are garbage. Watch more youtube videos and go through the lages here for thenright items youll need. This is not an inexpenisve endeavour, and is do able. As for the breeding, give it some time. If you still want to do it after owning your cham for a long while and you can do it successfully, then go for it. Just keeping then alive is not successful. If you cant provide proper heat, uvb, and humidity, your adult might deal with it, but those little babies will die.

where did you get 600? Just did some calculations and it would be like 1,300 for 1 month on federal income tax

 

[JoXie411]

I would like to see your set up or shopping list before you get the chameleon

I like that you want to make sure your babies go to good homes

 

[FloodedYeti]

Thanks for the mention.

There is a lot of good advice on here and you should pay attention.

As stated: 1)not a side job. This will consume your house with cages and feeders.
2) Don't buy from a box store but from a breeder. I strictly breed Panthers. @Matt Vanilla Gorilla has a lot of different species as well as Panthers.
3) get yourself the right set up for your first chameleon and see how that goes before you start setting your sites on breeding.
I recommend Panther or Nosy Be.

Good luck.

I would like to see your set up or shopping list before you get the chameleon.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...erSLg1uZinJOqimXF_8uVwDdLx1zRn/pub?output=pdf
I think I am missing some thing because the ending price looks way too cheap I also might get more plants I will start with 40 dollars worth and if that is not enough I will get more

 

[Beman]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...erSLg1uZinJOqimXF_8uVwDdLx1zRn/pub?output=pdf
I think I am missing some thing because the ending price looks way too cheap I also might get more plants I will start with 40 dollars worth and if that is not enough I will get more

Ok hun. I just checked out your list. So you will need more vines... But branches are better to use. I would get dragon ledges from dragonstrand.com and I would get a drip pan from them as well. The ledges will allow you to attach branches with zip ties. Branches are better for chams then the vines.

Also wrong uvb lighting. You need a t5HO fixture and a 5.0 uvb bulb and it should be a 24 inch fixture... Like this one. https://www.amazon.com/Zoo-Med-2605...932675&s=gateway&sprefix=T5HO+,aps,222&sr=8-3
But I do not know if this one comes with the bulb.

I prefer this one. It is a better brand and the bulb is good for 1 full year then you have to replace. http://www.lightyourreptiles.com/24...-arcadia-6-and-6-5k-day-light-bulbs-included/

 

[Daesie11]

where did you get 600? Just did some calculations and it would be like 1,300 for 1 month on federal income tax

Roughly 20 hours a week is the average part time, and tbh that's if you're lucky. It's probably more around 15 but we will round up to 20. You'll be lucky if you get paid more than $10. Tbh 10 is nice. I started at 8.25 when I was 21 years old. So 80 hours a month at $10 an hour, then you have to account for any taxes that get taken out.

 

[FloodedYeti]

Roughly 20 hours a week is the average part time, and tbh that's if you're lucky. It's probably more around 15 but we will round up to 20. You'll be lucky if you get paid more than $10. Tbh 10 is nice. I started at 8.25 when I was 21 years old. So 80 hours a month at $10 an hour, then you have to account for any taxes that get taken out.

Oh I was going for 30ish

 

[Daesie11]

Oh I was going for 30ish

Someone may correct me if I'm wrong, but when I was a kid the law was that when you are working on a workers permit you cant work for more than 15 or 20 hours in a week, plus a bunch of other rules like you cant work more than 5 hours in a day you cant work after 9pm etc. That might just be CA though.
Even without those things being taken in to account you'll be lucky to find somewhere to give you 30 hours a week. I give my associates on average 15 hours a week with the exception of the ones who have been with us for a long time and are more of a shift lead than others. Obviously it also depends on what job you're looking at.

 

[FloodedYeti]

Oh I was going for 30ish

Someone may correct me if I'm wrong, but when I was a kid the law was that when you are working on a workers permit you cant work for more than 15 or 20 hours in a week, plus a bunch of other rules like you cant work more than 5 hours in a day you cant work after 9pm etc. That might just be CA though.
Even without those things being taken in to account you'll be lucky to find somewhere to give you 30 hours a week. I give my associates on average 15 hours a week with the exception of the ones who have been with us for a long time and are more of a shift lead than others. Obviously it also depends on what job you're looking at.

law is 8 hours a day for 6 days
https://www.lni.wa.gov/WorkplaceRights/TeenWorkers/Hours/

 

[Beman]

Someone may correct me if I'm wrong, but when I was a kid the law was that when you are working on a workers permit you cant work for more than 15 or 20 hours in a week, plus a bunch of other rules like you cant work more than 5 hours in a day you cant work after 9pm etc. That might just be CA though.
Even without those things being taken in to account you'll be lucky to find somewhere to give you 30 hours a week. I give my associates on average 15 hours a week with the exception of the ones who have been with us for a long time and are more of a shift lead than others. Obviously it also depends on what job you're looking at.

Depends on the State. They need to google their State and what the requirements are with a work permit for a certain age.

 

[Daesie11]

law is 8 hours a day for 6 days
https://www.lni.wa.gov/WorkplaceRights/TeenWorkers/Hours/

Clearly Washington is not nearly as protective of their children as CA is

But yeah, that's great, you dont really have any laws that will restrict your working, but that doesnt mean you are guaranteed those hours, just what you are allowed to work. Make sense?