Would you raise a Parsonii?
- Thread starter Eltortu
- Start date
nicholas
Established Member
I would personally love to raise them for conservation sake, I personally think that a good captive bred population needs to exist for this species to survive! I know that these chameleons can most likely survive deforestation as they adapt to their new surroundings, but they will not survive exporting or the "trade". I know people say to stop buying them and the collection will slow and eventually bring it to a trickle, but I don't believe this will ever happen as there will always be the need and want to have something that so many others want. The trade in China and Indonesia alone are decimating the numbers. I have bred and raised many many montanes and would consider it a privilege to help this species stay around!
Cainschams
New Member
Simply put............No. I have many other species that I would rather "try" and would rather keep than parsonii. Regardless of space restraints and difficulty. Besides the pain in the ass of breeding and incubating eggs that I hear about parsonii there are many other species just as intricate that I would rather breed instead.
Personally I do not think they are the "holy grail" of chameleons. In fact, they are bred and more experienced than a number of available (legal or non legal) species through out the world.
I would take a chance at truly breeding Kinyongia tavetana (a 35$ chameleon) than parsonii any day.
Personally I do not think they are the "holy grail" of chameleons. In fact, they are bred and more experienced than a number of available (legal or non legal) species through out the world.
I would take a chance at truly breeding Kinyongia tavetana (a 35$ chameleon) than parsonii any day.
eisentrauti
Avid Member
There are plenty of species which are way harder than parsoniis. Just because they are the most expensive ones (of the legal available chameleons) doesn't make them more difficult then others.
Texas Ranger
Avid Member
I agree with you. We need to create a good strong captive population. I just watched a video on Madagascar and how the forest are being destroyed at a alarming rate. The only thing is breeders Must keep records. I cant beleive this is not being done with all species. When I get into breeding (No matter what animal) I always keep records.
Anyway I do agree with saving the species.
warpdrive
Avid Member
I am in no way saying that the trade in Parsons may not be bad, but it is not in anyway as bad as deforestation.
when you remove the trees in wich they live, you are not only removing their home, you are removing their food and water source as well. forcing them to migrate leaves them open to predation, desimating the population even more.
what is worse is that many of the insects that had homes too around the trees will most likely never come back for many reasons, for hundreds of years (if left to grow back). even if it is left to grow back, the forest will lose tons of insects and other wild life needed in the forest in order to have the balance needed for the Parsonii to survive and thrive. they will be gone forever, never to return.
rain water will also decline, not just in that clearing, but also in the surrounding areas, as less rain forest means less rain. thus all chameleons around that area will suffer as a result of the deforestation.
I'm not saying that the trade of some wild cought chameleons such as Parsonii is harmless or any better, just that chopping down a bunch of trees is not harmless and that once the damage is done, it is done forever.
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back on topic:
like Jared Cain, I too do not think that Parsonii are the kings of the chameleon world and after listining to Laurie's adventures with her new Tavs, I would rather raise and maybe breed them, then take in such an animal as a Parsonii.
Harry
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eisentrauti
Avid Member
Good post Harry ! Everyone who has visited Madagascar during the last years told me that the illegal trade can't ever have an influence on the population of parsoniis and all the other animals like the habitat destruction has.
We should all realize this and stop this hypocritical yelling about the few illegal animals which end up in the pet trade.
We should all realize this and stop this hypocritical yelling about the few illegal animals which end up in the pet trade.
chameleonneeds
Avid Member
I would keep a Parsonii if I had the space and money but my only reason being because they are very good looking chams.
I also agree with Cain though, I would start on Jacksons and other African species rather than Parsons.
I also agree with Cain though, I would start on Jacksons and other African species rather than Parsons.
nicholas
Established Member
Which species would you personally consider harder or more difficult than parsonii?
Ryan Jarosek
New Member
General Parsonii care is not that hard at all. Not that much different than any other chameleon. Paying special attention to temperature and water intake. I have not really come across any chameleon that is hard to take care of or more difficult. Different maybe???(breeding thats another story). Its really just about what information you get.
If keeping a room cool when its hot outside is considered hard then I have a number of animals and a empty wallet that can prove that wrong. Its not hard just takes more consideration and planning.
eisentrauti
Avid Member
The real thing with chameleons is breeding in multiple generations. That's the thing which seperate the wheat from the chaff. I have much more respect towards somebody who has breed sternfeldis or hoehneliis in 5 generations than somebody who has one time juveniles of a rare Madagascar or South African species
nicholas
Established Member
Well with sterngeldi I'm on the third generation but ill let you know when I have hit generation 5, I've got some babies cooking which would make Gen 4. I have only worked with hoehnellii for a short period of time. I do agree with what most people are saying though, on here.
Ryan Jarosek
New Member
You have almost achived Bennys respect.
Sounds like you are describing Europe...
Anyway Benny, that would be breeding chameleons not keeping them. I don't think most people keep chameleons to breed. To some its the reward of keeping an animal and providing the correct care. no one person gets to decide what has more value or not.
I for one have total respect for everyone in this hobby. From the keepers to the big breeders. Everyone has the right to enjoy this hobby and get the respect they should for keeping a chameleon no matter what species or how "hard" they are to breed. Its a joke to look down or respect someone less because they have had more success with a particular animal. You belittle people by saying they are not as good as you are because they do not like the same animals or breed multiple generations.
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Ryan Jarosek
New Member
eisentrauti
Avid Member
Yeah, the strange American sense for morality
The biggest consumers of reptiles worldwide, but envy of every single animal species which isn't available
eisentrauti
Avid Member
Don't take my words out of the context Ryan, everybody knows what I'm trying to say with it.
Well, in my opinion breeding has much more value than just keeping, especially when sb has WC animals in his enclosures.
But I didn't write a single word about looking down on somebody or something similar. To respect somebody more doesn't rank others deeper or disrespect them, at least in my intention of this word.
To come back to the topic itself: In my opinion it's difficult to keep chameleons over several generations but not to raise a parsonii juvenile (if it's healthy)
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