HELP- Drunk chameleon Not using his back legs PLEASE HELP

[jonathan779]

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - Veiled, Male, only a few months old. I have only had this particular cham for about two weeks. I Really have only handled him to put him in his cage. Feeding - He gets 1-2 small crickets a day lightly dusted with Zoo meds Reptivite. - around noon sometimes a few hours before but I have not set up an exact schedule. crickets are fed a local pet stores cricket gutload along with oranges and carrots- crickets only dusted right before feeding
Supplements - Only Reptivite with d3 so far.
Watering - I have a reptifogger that I keep on for a few hours a day. I also mist with a spray bottle 3-4 times a day.- I do see him drinking but he is going about it a strange way now. He used to lick from the leaves but today he was using his extended tongue to "catch" the fog where the reptifogger meets the screen.
Fecal Description - color of feces is dark, not runny or overly hard but enough to stick to a sideways leaf a few droppings have a bit of an orangeish white color in the middle. have not seen him poop today. he has not been tested since I got him?
History - I have only had him for a short time so not much on history. since I first got him he was very energetic then he began to close his eyes more and more during the day.

Cage Info:
Cage Type - all screen cage. 16x16x20". he has a heating lamp produced by zoo med along with his lighting system - its a repti breeze box that came with a different uvb bulb.
Temperature - his basking spot is in the high 80s, 85-92 with varying perching posts going as low as 70. overnight temp is in the 60s. I have a thermometer with prongs next to his highest perching spot. Humidity - humidity levels have been a bit low with the open cage design- 60s according to a humidity temper, (not sure what that's called) reptifogger creates the humidity along with my spray showers.
Plants - I have one live plant in the cage and I cannot remember what its called but it is not poisionos to chams.
Placement - it is located in my upstairs closed in loft area where there is not a lot of draft or foot traffic.I would say its about 4-5 feet from the floor on a small table.Location - Missouri-

He is not bending or using his back legs to grasp onto his vines. it appears he is very weak with his front arms as well. its almost like hes about to fall off his vines when he starts swaying or climbing. he is also using his legs as a way to prop himself up but hes not grabbing onto anything, hes sorta using his legs as hooks.. he has also grabbed his tail a few times reaching for other vines. his lower abdomen looks white and swollen but his ribs and upper abdomen seem fine. his climbing looks so sad... like hes trying to do a pull up while his legs and tail are just hanging there and he cant quite make it. his back legs are also a whiteish green color. there also is not a vet around my area that can help reptiles that I have found.

 

[Andee]

Pictures would help greatly. Of both him and his environment.

But first off get rid of the reptivite with d3. You should be dusting you feeders with plain calcium without d3 every feeding, and twice a month should be dusting with reptivite without d3 or herptivite, and then twice a month dust with calcium with d3.

He needs to eat FAR more than he is. 1-2 small crickets a day is not nearly enough for a young cham. My panther cham used to eat 22 crickets a day. Though 14-18 is more the norm. In other words feed your little veiled as much as it will eat. Also you should feed more than just crickets, I suggest silkworms, small hornworms, roaches of some sort, veggies/fruit (in small amounts), and superworms on occasion.

There will probably be more people that chime in, this is just what I know needs to be changed.

 

[BKFritz]

Do you happen to have pictures of him and his set up?

I would ditch the orange cubes, they're junk. They will keep the crickets alive but will add nothing to their overall benefit. Do you know what is in the gut load from the store? You can buy good gut loads such as Bug Burger, or Cricket Crack. You can also use chameleon safe fruits and veggies. I believe kale and collard greens have a good level of calcium. Feeders are no better than what they are fed, so if you want the most out of them they have to eat like kings

Also, you shouldn't dust with calcium with D3 everyday. Twice each month is really all they need. Dust with plain calcium every feeding, cal w/d3 twice each month and a reptile multi vitiman twice each month.

He also needs to eat much more than 2-3 small crickets each day. There is no limit to the amount a baby can/should eat. My 3-month-old eats at least 15 each day, sometimes more.

I would lower your basking temps as well, for a baby, basking temps are good in the low 80's

 

[codiwatkins]

Post pictures...The back legs being white could be shed or poor circulation...He needs WAY MORE food. When did this start? Was it a sudden onset or did he gradually get weaker and weaker?

 

[jonathan779]

this was only last night and today. it was a very fast onset. and I am not sure how to post images. it asks me for a url. and I just fed him two small crickets lightly dusted with repti-cal and now his mouth is hanging open! and no I do not know what is in the gut load from my pet store.

 

[MelissaB]

The easiest way to post pics is by clicking on the paper clip, above where you type the post. It'll give you a pop up screen where you can upload pics directly from your computer. I hope your chameleon is ok, I'm sorry he's sick.

 

[BKFritz]

To post a picture:






After you choose your photo, click upload.
If you have more than one photo you will want to choose file and upload them individually before you close this window.



After you insert them into the message they will appear kind of like View attachment 12345. Once you submit your reply they will appear as pictures. You can also "preview Post" to see that they have uploaded properly.

 

[codiwatkins]

this was only last night and today. it was a very fast onset. and I am not sure how to post images. it asks me for a url. and I just fed him two small crickets lightly dusted with repti-cal and now his mouth is hanging open! and no I do not know what is in the gut load from my pet store.

Like he is choking hanging open?

 

[jonathan779]

ill have to wait for him to come out of hiding and for him to walk before I can post a good pic of him.

 

[codiwatkins]

You need to remove that substrate right away. I hope he isnt choking on it. . I know they have it at pet stores but it's not good to use and breeds bacteria. Just move his vines and get a picture of his back legs.

 

[oblgobl]

I think you really need to start looking for a good vet if you say where abouts you live perhaps someone can help you find somwhere close by. Chams are known to eat their substrate wich is why most people don't use it especially the type you use as it's not easy to digest. In a severe case of impaction it can cause weakness in the back legs even paralasis but If he is pooping regularly I would think impaction is not the case. It does seem to be quite serious though so I think you're going to need to find a vet.

 

[jonathan779]

I will take the substrate out asap. and I do not think he is choking because I could see in to his mouth and there was no obstruction. if a cricket bites his mouth will he do this out of pain? and im afraid to move the leaves right next to him because he is scared of me and I do not want him to recoil himself off his branch. but I will do this delicately.

 

[codiwatkins]

I think you really need to start looking for a good vet if you say where abouts you live perhaps someone can help you find somwhere close by. Chams are known to eat their substrate wich is why most people don't use it especially the type you use as it's not easy to digest. In a severe case of impaction it can cause weakness in the back legs even paralasis but If he is pooping regularly I would think impaction is not the case. It does seem to be quite serious though so I think you're going to need to find a vet.

What he/she said.

 

[jonathan779]

You need to remove that substrate right away. I hope he isnt choking on it. . I know they have it at pet stores but it's not good to use and breeds bacteria. Just move his vines and get a picture of his back legs.

what would you recommend as a substitute substrate

 

[BKFritz]

what would you recommend as a substitute substrate

It is recommend to use no substrate at all. If you want to make cleaning the bottom of the enclosure easier, you can use plain paper towels. Like was mentioned, the cham can eat it and choke or become impacted. Crickets can also burrow in it and will try to feed on the chameleon at night. A bare bottom is best but if you have to have something I would go with paper towels.

 

[codiwatkins]

what would you recommend as a substitute substrate

How is he now? Any pictures of his back legs yet? I don't use anything. It makes fidning poop easier and it's easier to wipe down!

 

[jonathan779]

he seems to be acting more normal but he is still closing his eyes more than he should be.



hes hanging with his stomach facing the top of the mesh with his legs dangling. "spread eagle" so to speak. strange positioning for pics. the white line is on his stomach if that helps with the visual. if its not clear enough let me know. his light is about to go off for the night though, so tomorrow morning I will get more of him actually trying to use his legs

 

[SycoSquirl]

take him to a vet, there are lists on the internet that will list vets by area, even if you have to drive an hour or so it should be done, also are his eyes deep set? In one of the pictures you took it looked like its eyes were sunken in which could be a sign of dehydration. Keep an eye on him and if you need to take him out do it, dont worry about him recoiling, if he needs help then he will learn to get over it, also you could catch him if he starts to fall

 

[jonathan779]

well I got an appointment with the vet but they are unable to get me in till tomorrow at 11. and this morning he had zero interest in his crickets.. my roaches that I use for my sengal cham are much too big for him so im not sure if I should go buy him different food (he ate 5 crickets total yesterday which is more than double of what he usually eats a day) or wait for the vet. when I offered up a cricket this morning he seemed very uninterested and turned his head away and opened and closed his mouth a few times until I took it away. he did not try to outstretch his tongue when his mouth was open so I believe he still has his full tongue extension. so if your counting that's 2 times in a day and a half that he is opening his mouth for what seems like no reason.. Any suggestions till tomorrow's vet visit?

 

[laurie]

Where in MO are you? my sister is in Springfield and can hook you up with an excellent vet. She can also give you some feeders his size other than just crickets.

For now get out your spray bottle and time the amount you mist him. Give hih a soft mist for 15, yes 15 minutes. That is the very best you can do for now. If you pm me your phone number I will have my sister (Lee) call you.