Interesting Raiden Faly

Ibleedcolors said:
If falys have never been presented as anything other than the typical blue/green, white, and red ( and people have been completely grilled for having something that looks slightly off) why would these "new gene" speculation Begin now?
What if the crossing came from earlier in the gene pool and is barely popping up again?
And if it is indeed a cross, I think the name of these famous faly chameleons should be excluded. Jmo.
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show me any other so called nosy falys that have yellow an orange in there body where the breeders still says there falys? there isnt anyother person breedin falys other then drew that will call these falys..
my falys do not have this ambilobe look these do.im sure this guy just like the 4 i was sent are goin be awesome lookin panther chameleons they just wont be in my stable. im not lookin to get in trouble with any of this i say he asked for opinions on why we think its a cross we told you.

i will also say i love bobbie my son from raiden an nala he is what a faly should be he also passed on his look to his son so this yellow/orange/red bodies your speakin of i just dont see..
 
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I just said that Raiden and/or Nala were crosses. Last page. Raiden came from Wylde and a WC female. Nala came from Slash and a WC female. If these two are producing both the red, white, and blue ones as well as these full red body ones then there would have to be some crossing in the WC females.
 
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Canny Chams said:
whats JMO? het is where they inheret a trait from each parent right?
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No it is were there are two alike reptiles let's say pastel ball pythons but the female is HET for albino well if you breed the two together you get super pastels now you take that offspring that are super pastel het albino and breed it with a albino you get half pastels and half albinos and no super pastels. I put a link up a few pages back that can tell you all you need to know.:) but chameleons I don't think have this ability IMO.
 
I dont have anything to compare to either Rob. Nobody else has been able to post pics of 10-20 fully grown adult males that they have produced from their faly pairing. There just simply has not been enough time. I was the first in Canada with them and they were still very new in the US. So not many have done what I have.

Ultimately I really dont have anything that I can campare to. I've seen one here and there but not many adults. This means Bobbie has some unpure blood in him somewhere as well as the other beauties Raiden produced.




robmd1 said:
show me any other so called nosy falys that have yellow an orange in there body where the breeders still says there falys? there isnt anyother person breedin falys other then drew that will call these falys..
my falys do not have this ambilobe look these do.im sure this guy just like the 4 i was sent are goin be awesome lookin panther chameleons they just wont be in my stable. im not lookin to get in trouble with any of this i say he asked for opinions on why we think its a cross we told you.

i will also say i love bobbie my son from raiden an nala he is what a faly should be he also passed on his look to his son so this yellow/orange/red bodies your speakin of i just dont see..
Click to expand...
 
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Raiden and nala were no crosses IMO. If it counts. I don't know about the other female though it would be nice to see some pics of all there babies... I have a nice ch faly clutch proving out now and this fist clutch is staying with me so I will be able to post as they grow and color up and turn in to adults...

Chameleon Nation said:
I just said that Raiden and/or Nala were crosses. Last page. Raiden came from Wylde and a WC female. Nala came from Slash and a WC female. If these two are producing both the red, white, and blue ones as well as these full red body ones then there would have to be some crossing in the WC females.
Click to expand...

Chameleon Nation said:
I dont have anything to compare to either Rob. Nobody else has been able to post pics of 10-20 fully grown adult males that they have produced from their faly pairing. There just simply has not been enough time. I was the first in Canada with them and they were still very new in the US. So not many have done what I have.

Ultimately I really dont have anything that I can campare to. I've seen one here and there but not many adults.
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I first noticed the crazy color in the very first clutch, but it was only one. Many of you have seen how that guy turned out. Then there were two in the second that went to a wholesaler because of the odd color. Then the next clutch and so on. I assumed they were pure cause most of them were turing out pure white. They were unbeilevable. Some things really are too good to be true.

People can still breed them and I bet most will turn out red white and blue, but some are going to be out there.



Texas Ranger said:
Raiden and nala were no crosses IMO. If it counts. I don't know about the other female though it would be nice to see some pics of all there babies... I have a nice ch faly clutch proving out now and this fist clutch is staying with me so I will be able to post as they grow and color up and turn in to adults...
Click to expand...
 
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Chameleon Nation said:
I just said that Raiden and/or Nala were crosses. Last page. Raiden came from Wylde and a WC female. Nala came from Slash and a WC female. If these two are producing both the red, white, and blue ones as well as these full red body ones then there would have to be some crossing in the WC females.
Click to expand...

Drew has said several times now in this thread that he now believes Raiden has some cross blood. Enough said.
 
Ok after all this and a lot of back tracking threw old threads . Your raiden/nala line was and is 100% faly even bud from chameleon alley you can see that all are faly... Now for this last clutch breed to raiden from niki witch is were this chameleon posted up came from because he is way to young to be from nala seeing as she just died at 5 and you quit breeding her a long time ago at lest 2 years ago. So this new raiden /niki line may be cross and how it happened only you and who you got her from to knows maybe there was a mix up in the US or maybe when you had them all shipped to you ..you grabbed the wrong bag/cup and thought that's what you grabbed. And I think there is a 3rd clutch you are proven out right now. But were I am getting at is don't run your whole line down in to the ground because you made a mistake we are only human and they are only chameleons. I think you have made some awesome real falys but this new raiden and new female clutch looks really odd to me. This is just my two cents. and I hope you keep making falys drew don't let one female screw up make you so mad you just c all the whole line cross because that is just not true in my eyes. Also if you want to see what aot of cb falys look like go to the UK forums and other countrys forums were this still rear locale has been breed for many more year over there.JMO
 
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The one at the beginning of this thread I do believe ismfrom Nala and Raiden. The last two clutches took close to 14 month incubation. I only had one other clutch that took longer. It is quite possible that this guy is a little older than is being said.

Thee solid red ones started showing up from the very beginning in every clutch. When you cross breed you will get some that look pure and some that looked cross. Hence the weird ones in all the clutches. Not all the babies from Nika and Raiden turned out like this some were pure white and one still has no color. See many people from this very same thread called Bud a cross and still do. They cant accept the fact that he came from the same clutch as theirs. Every major breeder believes this color should not be in the locale. Clark summed it up that this whole line is crossed.

No matter what Raiden was bread to some turned out like this. I have a third pairing here from a WC female and they will stay here until they about a year old.

The shipment that Nika came in on were all cb mitsio and faly. There were no ambilobe nor do I have any around the proper age. Alot said Ambanja aswell. I do not own one Ambanja.....not one.




Texas Ranger said:
Ok after all this and a lot of back tracking threw old threads . Your raiden/nala line was and is 100% faly even bud from chameleon alley you can see that all are faly... Now for this last clutch breed to raiden from niki witch is were this chameleon posted up came from because he is way to young to be from nala seeing as she just died at 5 and you quit breeding her a long time ago at lest 2 years ago. So this new raiden /niki line may be cross and how it happened only you and who you got her from to knows maybe there was a mix up in the US or maybe when you had them all shipped to you ..you grabbed the wrong bag/cup and thought that's what you grabbed. And I think there is a 3rd clutch you are proven out right now. But were I am getting at is don't run your whole line down in to the ground because you made a mistake we are only human and they are only chameleons. I think you have made some awesome real falys but this new raiden and new female clutch looks really odd to me. This is just my two cents. and I hope you keep making falys drew don't let one female screw up make you so mad you just c all the whole line cross because that is just not true in my eyes. Also if you want to see what aot of cb falys look like go to the UK forums and other countrys forums were this still rear locale has been breed for many more year over there.JMO
Click to expand...
 
Ok that's fine you are the breeder of all these chams and what you say is I guess what you think. As for incubation time that seems really long after 12 month of incubation I have never had a baby hatch out of the egg they just seem to be not right and never hatch. Whatever the case maybe drew you have made some awesome falys and chameleons weather some be pure or cross.. its all just what you and people want and breed for. and I hope you keep working with these reptiles they are all amazing...

Chameleon Nation said:
The one at the beginning of this thread I do believe ismfrom Nala and Raiden. The last two clutches took close to 14 month incubation. I only had one other clutch that took longer. It is quite possible that this guy is a little older than is being said.

Thee solid red ones started showing up from the very beginning in every clutch. When you cross breed you will get some that look pure and some that looked cross. Hence the weird ones in all the clutches. Not all the babies from Nika and Raiden turned out like this some were pure white and one still has no color. See many people from this very same thread called Bud a cross and still do. They cant accept the fact that he came from the same clutch as theirs. Every major breeder believes this color should not be in the locale. Clark summed it up that this whole line is crossed.

No matter what Raiden was bread to some turned out like this. I have a third pairing here from a WC female and they will stay here until they about a year old.

The shipment that Nika came in on were all cb mitsio and faly. There were no ambilobe nor do I have any around the proper age. Alot said Ambanja aswell. I do not own one Ambanja.....not one.
Click to expand...
 
Our incubation periods are longer in most. They usually run 10-11 months, some longer, some shorter. I believe in slower incubation times. They make stronger and healthier babies.





=Texas Ranger;729230]Ok that's fine you are the breeder of all these chams and what you say is I guess what you think. As for incubation time that seems really long after 12 month of incubation I have never had a baby hatch out of the egg they just seem to be not right and never hatch. Whatever the case maybe drew you have made some awesome falys and chameleons weather some be pure or cross.. its all just what you and people want and breed for. and I hope you keep working with these reptiles they are all amazing...[/QUOTE]
 
I do the same I don't rush them I just let it happen I think that is a great thing you do not rush them.... not many people still do that as they are only in it for the money.

Chameleon Nation said:
Our incubation periods are longer in most. They usually run 10-11 months, some longer, some shorter. I believe in slower incubation times. They make stronger and healthier babies.





=Texas Ranger;729230]Ok that's fine you are the breeder of all these chams and what you say is I guess what you think. As for incubation time that seems really long after 12 month of incubation I have never had a baby hatch out of the egg they just seem to be not right and never hatch. Whatever the case maybe drew you have made some awesome falys and chameleons weather some be pure or cross.. its all just what you and people want and breed for. and I hope you keep working with these reptiles they are all amazing...
Click to expand...
[/QUOTE]
 
Texas Ranger said:
Ok after all this and a lot of back tracking threw old threads . Your raiden/nala line was and is 100% faly even bud from chameleon alley you can see that all are faly... Now for this last clutch breed to raiden from niki witch is were this chameleon posted up came from because he is way to young to be from nala seeing as she just died at 5 and you quit breeding her a long time ago at lest 2 years ago. So this new raiden /niki line may be cross and how it happened only you and who you got her from to knows maybe there was a mix up in the US or maybe when you had them all shipped to you ..you grabbed the wrong bag/cup and thought that's what you grabbed. And I think there is a 3rd clutch you are proven out right now. But were I am getting at is don't run your whole line down in to the ground because you made a mistake we are only human and they are only chameleons. I think you have made some awesome real falys but this new raiden and new female clutch looks really odd to me. This is just my two cents. and I hope you keep making falys drew don't let one female screw up make you so mad you just c all the whole line cross because that is just not true in my eyes. Also if you want to see what aot of cb falys look like go to the UK forums and other countrys forums were this still rear locale has been breed for many more year over there.JMO
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This is exactly right. I don't see how this 7mo could really be from Nala, he is the same age as the rest of the Nika clutch.

The person really to ask is Ed Kammer he has more experience than anyone I know with purposely crossing chameleons and seeing the result. He has kept close records on what he has crossed what the percentages are and the outcomes. I am pretty sure he would tell you that when you cross lines you can see the results in the offspring and not just 1 in 100. Now I am sure they didn't all look the same. You see this all the time with Ambilobes you have some red bar some blue bar and some red/blue bar in the same clutch. But as I mentioned above you have much less genetic diversity with the more isolated gene pools such as nosy Mitsio, Nosy Faly etc. You see a lot of kammer babies on the board and you have JonRich who has a mostly orange body out of Son Tiger and I got a Yellow body with orange head and tail and blue bars out of the same sire. This is due to the great diversity in the females from ambilobe. This diversity just isn't seen in Nosy Faly.

And Drew no where in my posts does it say the whole line is crossed or that Raiden was a cross. To set the record straight.
 
I wish Liddy Kammer would post on this thread about crosses because she has been doing it for a very long time.

I spoke with her a few years ago about crosses and how the offspring can look like either local or like crosses.
 
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