lindseymeder16
New Member
Got an update: rango is stable and his colors have gotten better. Dr.driggers is still worried on how he is going to do
Randomly Lethargic and Sleepy
- Thread starter lindseymeder16
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Elizadolots
New Member
I'm crossing all available digits for Rango!
lindseymeder16
New Member
Yeah, he was really nice and knew alot. Im glad we went to him rather than the other vet.
Thank you!
lindseymeder16
New Member
Thank you so much!
xanthoman
Avid Member
hyperphosphatemia=hyperperuricemia
hyperphosphatemia is caused by too high of phosphorus levels in the diet which cause a pth imbalance leading to hyperuricemia (high levels of uric acid) which can lead to gout or even osmotic lysis/renal failure. all this is going to cause all sorts of other probs including dehydration and inability to process vitamins, regardless of the amount given,leading to lethrgy, loss of balance, and appetite, may also affect its desire to drink. excess phosphorus is handled by the kidneys, but even a healthy kidney can only handle so much, once it reaches a certain point, gout, osmotic lysis or even renal failure are likely to set in with minimal chance of recovery.
actually there is a method to purge excess calcium using mylanta, or certain other laxatives but since you are already under vet care it would be inappropriate to recomend it here.
for multiple reasons, crickets, superworms, and mealworms all make poor staples. imo, no single feeder should make up more than %40 of the overall diet and imo, dubia are the best suited for that. imo, i would recommend feeding way less crickets and superworms and eliminating mealworms altogether, instead i would replace them with silks, bsfl and hornworms, bbf.
how do you measure your humidity? imo your cage would probably hold humidity much longer if it was setup better.
you didnt mention anything about gutloading. balanced gutloading is essential to the proper long term health of a cham
this all boils down to an issue of husbandry, if you dont learn to fix it, it will just happen again, each time its much less likely to be fixable. jmo
hyperphosphatemia is caused by too high of phosphorus levels in the diet which cause a pth imbalance leading to hyperuricemia (high levels of uric acid) which can lead to gout or even osmotic lysis/renal failure. all this is going to cause all sorts of other probs including dehydration and inability to process vitamins, regardless of the amount given,leading to lethrgy, loss of balance, and appetite, may also affect its desire to drink. excess phosphorus is handled by the kidneys, but even a healthy kidney can only handle so much, once it reaches a certain point, gout, osmotic lysis or even renal failure are likely to set in with minimal chance of recovery.
actually there is a method to purge excess calcium using mylanta, or certain other laxatives but since you are already under vet care it would be inappropriate to recomend it here.
for multiple reasons, crickets, superworms, and mealworms all make poor staples. imo, no single feeder should make up more than %40 of the overall diet and imo, dubia are the best suited for that. imo, i would recommend feeding way less crickets and superworms and eliminating mealworms altogether, instead i would replace them with silks, bsfl and hornworms, bbf.
how do you measure your humidity? imo your cage would probably hold humidity much longer if it was setup better.
you didnt mention anything about gutloading. balanced gutloading is essential to the proper long term health of a cham
this all boils down to an issue of husbandry, if you dont learn to fix it, it will just happen again, each time its much less likely to be fixable. jmo
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lindseymeder16
New Member
The vet explained the phosphorus to me basically the same exact way you put it.
I did mention my gutloading in the "how to ask for help" form i posted in the beginning. I said I gutload with all types of greens and carrots.
My cage is set up how every one else on here has their cages set up. I am going to be useing a humidifier agian to try and get the humidity up. I have always had trouble with humidity in all of my lizard cages. I live in arizona...where there is never even any humidity so how am i suppose to constantly keep it up??? I have tried seran wrap on the bottom of the cage and that does nothing. My humidifier hardly does anything but raise it by like 10-15%. Rango has never even seemed bothered by low humidity. I have two large plants in the cage to try and hold the humidity aswell. I use a digital thermometer and hygrometer in one. So, it meausres both in one device.
I have no where to get any of those besides if I order them online and that is a bit exspensive for me right now. When I get the extra money I buy him stuff from mulberry farms but that is rare.
ataraxia
Avid Member
Im placing a bet. 1.He needs more water. 2.His nutrition needs to change. (Gut loading, choice of supplements, scheduled regiment and feeders)..
I dont think you chameleon has a infection. He just needs a little more attention.
We need to re evaluate what you are currently doing to fix the issue. He is in this condition because of something we are not doing on purpose but something that we may be overlooking or oblivious to. If you chameleon were mine this is what i would do.
1.Shower chamber as much as possible and only if he is acceptable to this. If he is not, mist his cage from the top for 30-60 seconds step away for a minute then come back and mist for 5 minutes or so.
2.Re evaluate your plan for nutrition for this guy.
a.Gut loading: I would leave out any ingredients that are particularly high in phosphorus. You can google any ingredient and get nutritional facts. Sandrachameleons and ferretsinmyshoes blogs have great suggestions.
b.Supplements: Your plain calcium needs to be Phosphorus free..This is to be used every feeding to balance out the ca/phos levels of most insects. Multivitamin: I would go with a product called reptivite for this and use this twice a month.
c.Choice of feeders: At the moment i would choose silk worms, horn worms and crickets as the only feeders in the regiment.
lindseymeder16
New Member
His white blood cell count was 3,000 - which is way to high and that indicates an infection. He is dehydrated because of the infection. Dr.Driggers said that he probabley does have excess phosphorus and that is what he is worried about as well as the infection attacking the kidneys and liver.
I am ovbiously more than willing to help him. I will check out those blogs you were talking about and change the gut loading for Rango. My plain calcium is phosphorus free.
Do you know how to keep silks? They are rango's favorite but I havent gotten them ever since all mine went moldy and gross the first time I bought them.
I give Rango outside time almost every weekend and he gets a shower with my misting hose. I took him outside and gave him a shower on Thursday and Friday when he started to go down hill and he was not interested in drinking at all. Dr.Driggers is hydrateing him through IV's till monday and if Rango makes it Dr.Driggers is going to show me how to the same thing. We are cleaning my misting system right now so I will make sure to see if we can get the settings on longer than 45 seconds.
Flapenn
New Member
sorry to hear about your cham, hope he gets better 
about your mistking only being able to go off for 45 seconds....thats just not true at all lol
the timer has 8 diff misting sessions you can set. Each one of these sessions has a time to start and a time to stop. If you press the prog. buttom it will go to session 1 ON and you can set the time to lets say 9:30:00am and then press prog again and then it will have you set the time for session 1 OFF and you can set this to 9:30:01 creating a 1 second mist or set it to 9:29:59am and it will run all day except for one second. I think you get the idea. If this isnt clear enough let me know and i can post the original instructions that came with it lol.
about your mistking only being able to go off for 45 seconds....thats just not true at all lol
the timer has 8 diff misting sessions you can set. Each one of these sessions has a time to start and a time to stop. If you press the prog. buttom it will go to session 1 ON and you can set the time to lets say 9:30:00am and then press prog again and then it will have you set the time for session 1 OFF and you can set this to 9:30:01 creating a 1 second mist or set it to 9:29:59am and it will run all day except for one second. I think you get the idea. If this isnt clear enough let me know and i can post the original instructions that came with it lol.
lindseymeder16
New Member
sorry to hear about your cham, hope he gets better
about your mistking only being able to go off for 45 seconds....thats just not true at all lol
the timer has 8 diff misting sessions you can set. Each one of these sessions has a time to start and a time to stop. If you press the prog. buttom it will go to session 1 ON and you can set the time to lets say 9:30:00am and then press prog again and then it will have you set the time for session 1 OFF and you can set this to 9:30:01 creating a 1 second mist or set it to 9:29:59am and it will run all day except for one second. I think you get the idea. If this isnt clear enough let me know and i can post the original instructions that came with it lol.
Thank you, I will show my dad this since he is the one that sets it up.
lindseymeder16
New Member
Rango has passed away this afternoon.
ataraxia
Avid Member
Silks are really simple as long as you give them just a minute of attention every day.
I personally give enough food to last 1-2 days. This way the food does not mold and you clean the poo out at the same time as the food change. Goes hand and hand. Keep them at room temps 72-76 is great.
If you can buy eggs and chow. You will save so much money in the long run.
I personally give enough food to last 1-2 days. This way the food does not mold and you clean the poo out at the same time as the food change. Goes hand and hand. Keep them at room temps 72-76 is great.
If you can buy eggs and chow. You will save so much money in the long run.
lindseymeder16
New Member
Thank you both. I am going be getting an autopsy done on him.
ChamMan7
Established Member
If his eyes are sunken below their usual levels, an you haven't been misting him by hand as well as with the mistking for a few days then he is probably dehydrated. Any yellow in the Urine also points towards dehydration, as does the weakness and lethargy.Also, How old are your UVB lights? If the bulbs are over eight months to a year old, the decreas in energy could mean that he is not getting enough UVB exposure. The energy decrease could be the reason he's not showing much interest in his mistings. In which case it's time for some new bulbs.
You should extend the mistings to about two to three minutes every five hours, make sure he's getting enough of his multivitamin, and take him by a vet just to be sure! Let us know how he's doing!
You should extend the mistings to about two to three minutes every five hours, make sure he's getting enough of his multivitamin, and take him by a vet just to be sure! Let us know how he's doing!
Elizadolots
New Member
I'm so sorry Rango died.
Just to satisfy my curiosity....was he captive bred or wild caught?
Just to satisfy my curiosity....was he captive bred or wild caught?
lindseymeder16
New Member
Thanks, he was captive bred.
