Chameleons closed eyes

Lailanni

Lailanni

New Member
Hello! Im a new Cham owner and doing my best to give him the best! Ive had my Veiled Chameleon for about 3-4 months. Hes been good since I got him but now leaving me a bit nervous. Not too long ago I noticed his eyes closed with his lights still on. I did tons of research before getting him and understand that closed eyes may not be a good sign.
Now, I am left a bit confused as I try to find answers online. Some blogs I see say this is very bad but others say it isnt so bad. Hes still happily eating all his food, climbing on all his plants and I havent noticed an odd behaviors.
Im not sure were to gi from here. Maybe its just because Im new that im worrying so much but I just want to make sure everything is alright with him. Any advice?
 
So eye issues can be a number of things. I’m going to attach a husbandry form for you. Copy paste and fill in with as much info as possible. This will help narrow things down. Photos of your baby and enclosure will also be a great help.

Chameleon Info:

  • Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
  • Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
  • Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
  • Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?
  • Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
  • Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
  • History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.


Cage Info:

  • Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
  • Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
  • Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
  • Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
  • Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
  • Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
  • Location - Where are you geographically located?


Current Problem - The current problem you are concerned about.



--------------



Please Note:

  1. The more details you provide the better and more accurate help you will receive.
  2. Photos can be very helpful.
 
Lailanni said:
Hello! Im a new Cham owner and doing my best to give him the best! Ive had my Veiled Chameleon for about 3-4 months. Hes been good since I got him but now leaving me a bit nervous. Not too long ago I noticed his eyes closed with his lights still on. I did tons of research before getting him and understand that closed eyes may not be a good sign.
Now, I am left a bit confused as I try to find answers online. Some blogs I see say this is very bad but others say it isnt so bad. Hes still happily eating all his food, climbing on all his plants and I havent noticed an odd behaviors.
Im not sure were to gi from here. Maybe its just because Im new that im worrying so much but I just want to make sure everything is alright with him. Any advice?
Click to expand...
Hi and welcome. :) It is not a good sign when a chameleon has its eyes closed during the day. It is a sign that something is wrong and needs to be corrected asap. There is a ton of misinformation out there about keeping chameleons and it’s so difficult to know what is right. With chameleons, there’s usually little room for error, so even what may seem small can have profound effects. We’d love to help figure it out with you. Afraid that we do need lots more info though and the best way is to answer all of the above questions.
 
Gloriawood said:
Chameleon Info:
Click to expand...
Thanks so much for offering to help! I tried my best to answer everything below!

Chameleon Info:

  • Your Chameleon - Pascals a male Veiled Chameleon, not sure his age but I was told hes a juvinile when i got him. Ive had him for around 3-4 months
  • Handling - Im still working on getting him used to handling, probably 1-2 times a week
  • Feeding - Im feeding him 10 small Dubia Roachs threw out the day along with super worms and wax worms as treats
  • Supplements - I use the Zoo Med calcium with and without D3. I use without D3 daily on his dubia roaches and with D3 the first and last saturday of each month
  • Watering - I use a hand held spray bottle, spraying for 3 minutes in the morning and 3 minutes at night. I dont always see him drinking water but i have seen him drinking water before
  • Fecal Description - his droppings have kinda been in the middle, not too dry or wet. His urite is really like a creme color
  • History - Never had any issues until now


Cage Info:

  • Cage Type - I have Pascal in a mess, glass cage. Pretty sure the dementions are 16x16x20 ( Dont fully remember )
  • Lighting - I typically turn on his day light and uvb bulb at 7 am then turn them off and turn on his heat bulb at 7 pm
  • Temperature - I normally get his tempertaure around 75-80 during the day and around 60-70 at night. I have a little thememeture that goes on the back of the glass.
  • Humidity - During the day i keep it between 30-40 and at night i use a fogger to get up to 70
  • Plants - All pascals plants are live. Mainly being pothos
  • Placement - I have his cage in the corner of my bed room sittin ontop of my dresser. He is a bit close to the window
  • Location - I live in New Jersey ( part of the reason i use a heating bulb at night bc it gets pretty cold during the winter here )


Current Problem - Eyes closed during the day
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I’m going to let a more experienced keeper give a full husbandry review, but I do see a couple things right off the bat that could be causing your little ones issues. The UVB light you are using is not providing enough for him. Unfortunatley the coil bulbs do not penetrate far enough in the enclosure. You need a linear UVB. I’ll link one from Amazon. It needs to be a T5HO and the strength needs to be either 5.0 or 6%.

The second thing I see that may be causing issues is your vitamins. Calcium without D3 is perfect for every feeding so that’s good. But Pascal needs a multivitamin twice a month as well. When you use the calcium with D3, he is not getting vitamin a. I will also link the multivitamin I reccomend. Use the calcium just like you are, and then the 1st and 15th of each month use repashy plus loD. This is a combo multivitamin and D3 so no need for the other calcium.


REPTI ZOO 24W Reptile T5 HO UVB Lighting Combo Kit, 22" Light Fixture Reptile Terrarium Hood, with Detachable Curved Reflector and 5.0 UVB T5 Lamp Bulb, ETL certificated https://a.co/d/5tg2SrO

Repashy Calcium Plus LoD 3 Oz JAR https://a.co/d/6xytcdl
 
I’ll go over your husbandry in a bit, but in the meantime are you able to get a closer/clearer pic of Pascal’s face? I know they like to turn to the side when the camera is in front of them, and a side pic is fine. I need to see clearer by his nose and eyes. Thanks.
 
Your day and night time temps and humidity are pretty good but a heat light is not needed or recommended, give them complete darkness at night and they need the night time drop in temperature. As mentioned your supplements are a little off, I recommend Reptical without D3 every feeding and RepashyLoD twice a month. He would also appreciate a upgrade to a minimum enclosure of 24x24x48 and as mentioned a linear T5HO fixture and uvb bulb.
 
Putting my feedback in bold. I’ll be breaking this into two sections. Not only do i talk a lot, but i think it makes it easier to process. :)

  • Your Chameleon - Pascals a male Veiled Chameleon, not sure his age but I was told hes a juvinile when i got him. Ive had him for around 3-4 months Unless he was a tiny hatchling or close to it, he should be showing his vertical big boy bars…and he isn’t. This makes me question if he may be a she. The best way to tell is to post a pic of his back heels. If a boy, he should have some prominent nubs called tarsal spurs. Girls can have tiny nubs sometimes and we need to make sure. For the sake of this review, I’m going to assume that you have a 5 month old girl.
  • Handling - Im still working on getting him used to handling, probably 1-2 times a week This is a great blog to help you build up some trust. Veileds aren’t known to be very friendly and she may never willingly come out into your hand, but it’s important she have some trust in you.
  • Feeding - Im feeding him 10 small Dubia Roachs threw out the day along with super worms and wax worms as treats Ok. This is where gender and age are super important. Since our girls can mature as young as 5-6 months and start producing eggs, we need to be careful not to overfeed them. We don’t want to stunt their growth either, so it can be tricky. I’m going to say keep feeding her 10 feeders daily, once in the morning only. In a couple of weeks you can start cutting back on the amount, so that by the time she’s around 6-7 months old, she’s getting 5-8 feeders daily. You want to give more variety of staple feeders. You also need to feed and care for them well, so that they will be healthy and therefore, more nutritious. I’m attaching some graphics to help guide you. Btw, most of the bug food you’ll find at the big box pet stores, like the orange cubes, jelly pots and stuff will keep the bugs alive, but not healthy or nutritious.
  • Supplements - I use the Zoo Med calcium with and without D3. I use without D3 daily on his dubia roaches and with D3 the first and last saturday of each month Ok, this is close, but not quite. You would want to give the calcium with D3 the first and third Saturday instead. She also needs a multivitamin without D3 that you’d use on the 2nd and 4th Saturday. OR, a much easier way is to get rid of the calcium with D3 altogether. You’ll still give the calcium without D3 at every feeding, but instead of separate multivitamin and D3, you’ll use a combination product like Repashy Calcium Plus LoD or ReptiVite with D3 for one feeding every other week (like the 1st & 3rd Saturdays of the month). This is the easier way and the supplements mentioned are fantastic for your cham as they contain preformed vitamin A, which is needed for good eye health. Other multivitamins contain proformed A, which we aren’t sure if chams can utilize it very well or at all.
  • Watering - I use a hand held spray bottle, spraying for 3 minutes in the morning and 3 minutes at night. I dont always see him drinking water but i have seen him drinking water before Perfect. Many chameleons are secretive about drinking, so we go by the color of the urate. All white or with a touch of yellow on the end is good.
  • Fecal Description - his droppings have kinda been in the middle, not too dry or wet. His urite is really like a creme color Good. It is always best to get a fecal check for parasites. You’ll need to have a veterinary wellness exam in order to get the fecal done. Just vets following the laws.
  • History - Never had any issues until now
IMG_0151.jpeg
IMG_1188.jpeg
 
I know some other members have already given you fantastic advice on some of this stuff already. I’m going to be repeating what they’ve already told you…just keeps my brain on track. lol

  • Cage Type - I have Pascal in a mess, glass cage. Pretty sure the dementions are 16x16x20 ( Dont fully remember ) She will be needing much larger than this. The standard minimum for an adult veiled is 2x2x4’ or equivalent. If you can go even bigger than that, your chameleon will really enjoy the extra space. This is a good way to do that. https://chameleonacademy.com/double-wide-chameleon-cage-project/
  • Lighting - I typically turn on his day light and uvb bulb at 7 am then turn them off and turn on his heat bulb at 7 pm The 12 hour schedule is perfect! Unless your night time temps are dropping below the mid 50’s, you don’t need or want the night time heat. A night temp in the 60’s is ideal. Now let’s talk about your uvb. The screw in bulbs aren’t able to provide any uvb farther than a few inches. You need to get a linear T5HO fixture with either ReptiSun 5.0 or Arcadia 6%. This is the uvb that is needed. https://www.lightyourreptiles.com/arcadia-pro-t5-fixture-6-bulb-22-5-sale-now-only-69-99/ Once you get that, then you need a distance of 8-9” between the light and the basking area.
  • Temperature - I normally get his tempertaure around 75-80 Desired basking temp for a girl is 78-80 and no higher. during the day and around 60-70 at night. I have a little thememeture that goes on the back of the glass. The best way to measure temps at basking area is to have a digital thermometer with a probe end. Place the probe at the basking branch.
  • Humidity - During the day i keep it between 30-40 and at night i use a fogger to get up to 70 Perfect! Just an fyi - you never want to boost humidity when temps are above 68-70. Heat plus high humidity increases risk for respiratory infection.
  • Plants - All pascals plants are live. Mainly being pothos Excellent! There should be many more though and up higher. I’ll add a separate post about how to hang things. She needs many more branches and vines…lots of little roads to travel. Different thickness of branches is best to keep mitten feet muscles exercised.
  • Placement - I have his cage in the corner of my bed room sittin ontop of my dresser. He is a bit close to the window Ok. Height = safety. Just make sure that there are no cold drafts from the window and that during the day, the sun isn’t coming thru and baking her.
  • Location - I live in New Jersey ( part of the reason i use a heating bulb at night bc it gets pretty cold during the winter here )

Current Problem - Eyes closed during the day I’m not a vet so can only make a guess based on what you’ve told and showed me. With her not having correct (really any) uvb, that is going to cause problems for every part of her and if not corrected, will cause metabolic bone disease which is too often fatal. It takes some time for that to happen, but not as much as you’d think. The uvb light is priority - she needs it yesterday. The other problem is she hasn’t been getting any multivitamins, which can have a variety of issues with most often it showing most with eyes. This too was needed to be corrected yesterday and is priority. I asked for better pics of her face as it looks like she has some little bumps between her eyes and nose.
If her eye problems are indeed from lack of proper uvb and supplements, you may start to see some small improvement within a week of providing these things, but full recovery usually takes longer.
Seeing a vet is always a good idea, but do make sure they have a good amount of experience with and knowledge about chameleons. If you need help finding a good vet, we can help.
 
Hanging things can be a challenge in screen enclosures, but there are ways. My favorite is Dragon Ledges. https://dragonstrand.com/dragon-ledges/ The weight that they hold is amazing! Not too long ago I didn’t have any and needed to set up an enclosure quickly, so i had to improvise. I had some scrap garden trellis so used that. I drilled some holes where needed on the ends and attached it to the frame using thin wire. Later when using again, i had the good sense to put some small screws into the frame to hold the wires to prevent everything from sliding down. This is sturdy enough to hold lots of branches and even some plants. This is how another member has hung some plants and it’s a great idea! https://www.chameleonforums.com/threads/hanging-flower-pots-in-photos.191946/
I use branches I’ve scavenged when my neighbors trim their oak trees. Avoid pine, eucalyptus and other trees that are sappy or smelly. Using soapy water (dish soap) i give a little scrub with a plastic bristled brush. Anything like lichen that doesn’t come off with normal scrubbing gets to stay. The i rinse the heck out of it and let dry. That’s it. No baking, no bleaching or any of that.
Since i believe you may have a girl, I’m giving you this to read about egg laying. https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/veiled-chameleon-laying-101.2488/
 
Gloriawood said:
Calcium
Click to expand...
Alright, so!! I actually had to get Pascal more food yesterday and got the chance to talk with a worker about a few things. Which actually explained the big thing about Pascal actually being a girl! He explained that this maybe is why shes been a bit off this week, that theres a possibility she getting close to laying her first bunch of eggs!! He answered alot of my questions and even gave me a more in depth care sheet! Now im in the process of making her laying bin and im also looking into everything everyone had mentioned. First getting her a bigger enclosure and much better lighting. So thanks so so much for the extra advice!! 😁
 
Lailanni said:
Alright, so!! I actually had to get Pascal more food yesterday and got the chance to talk with a worker about a few things. Which actually explained the big thing about Pascal actually being a girl! He explained that this maybe is why shes been a bit off this week, that theres a possibility she getting close to laying her first bunch of eggs!! He answered alot of my questions and even gave me a more in depth care sheet! Now im in the process of making her laying bin and im also looking into everything everyone had mentioned. First getting her a bigger enclosure and much better lighting. So thanks so so much for the extra advice!! 😁
Click to expand...
Awesome! That’s actually why we were asking to see the back of her feet 😂 we thought she might be a girl. The males will have a little nub called a tarsal spur and the females do not.
 
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