Coccidia

[GabeCastro]

IS A PAIN IN THE @#*!!! lol

It's so difficult taking care of a chameleon with coccidia...I wish Jasper would just eat something beside soldier flies. He doesn't eat anything.

This worries me allot. I can't give him his proper dusting schedule, and i'm worried he might be getting un supplemented. Today i force fed him some drops of water mixed with calcium. I may have to do this everyday and let him eat the soldier flies on his own. or i can force feed him a cricket or two. Should i throw some calcium dust w/no d3 into his dripper?

Not sure what to do at this point, I was really hoping he would get his appetite back but it's just not happening. I hate force feeding him because i'm afraid i'm stressing him out too much/hurting him.

Waiting for his next dump so I can get another fecal test, hopefully showing good signs that his coccidia is dropping. Also if he passed all the pinworms.

Anyone have any tips they could give me to help his appetite grow? I have reptiaid, but my vet told me to take him off of it since i'm giving Jasper Panacure and Ponazuril. But i'm debating on just giving him a dose for 10 days straight. He's been taking the meds for the past month and I've really haven't seen any improvements other than him eating soldier flies. His poop is still on the weird side, and still has a slight smell to it. I've literally tried every feeder you can think of but he just won't eat anything.

 

[andred82vert]

Try giving hi weed like that other member did ( I think it was his pet sitter)

 

[GabeCastro]

Try giving hi weed like that other member did ( I think it was his pet sitter)

Haha I think Jasper would have the munchies and only crave waxworms...

 

[Meow Kitty]

I have gotten my cham High before with a friend and it defiantly doesnt make them hungry... it made him very active and a little disoriented along with that i read that it can kill them as their lungs are a lot smaller then ours and smoke is fatal... almost like how birds are more susceptible to poisons.

try taking him outside it promotes eating offer different things everyday ... try moving him to his basking spot my cham looses his appetite if he hasnt basked or is cold

 

[nickl123]

my 5mo veiled currently has coccidia but his condition is improving considerably.

2 months ago, all he would eat was a few small pieces of kale or collard greens. to promote an appetite wax worms!!! their high in fat so they act as a prevention to weight loss, a couple wax worms is better than nothing.

my med schedule is 7 days on 7 days off x3 (trimethoprim sulfa)

i phased out the fatty wax worms with silkworms (i figured they were both white so maybe he would think the silkies were a bigger wax worm loll)

now (after his second 7 day dosage) he is up to about 10-crix a day and i try to get him to eat a hornworm

follow the med schedule and be patient make sure your cham is well hydrated, clean up his poop as fast as you can, and clean the enclosure more often while medicating. also make sure your humidity is good and if there is room for a temp increase do so (i found with an increase in temp and 2 extra sprayings he became alot less lethargic)

if your cham is a veiled dust some veges and see if hell take.

also if your are "force feeding" use something more substantial like a silkworm or horn worm

This is all from my current experience with coccidia and vet reccomendations

 

[mcbdz]

my 5mo veiled currently has coccidia but his condition is improving considerably.

2 months ago, all he would eat was a few small pieces of kale or collard greens. to promote an appetite wax worms!!! their high in fat so they act as a prevention to weight loss, a couple wax worms is better than nothing.

my med schedule is 7 days on 7 days off x3 (trimethoprim sulfa)

i phased out the fatty wax worms with silkworms (i figured they were both white so maybe he would think the silkies were a bigger wax worm loll)

now (after his second 7 day dosage) he is up to about 10-crix a day and i try to get him to eat a hornworm

follow the med schedule and be patient make sure your cham is well hydrated, clean up his poop as fast as you can, and clean the enclosure more often while medicating. also make sure your humidity is good and if there is room for a temp increase do so (i found with an increase in temp and 2 extra sprayings he became alot less lethargic)

if your cham is a veiled dust some veges and see if hell take.

also if your are "force feeding" use something more substantial like a silkworm or horn worm

This is all from my current experience with coccidia and vet reccomendations

I know this seems endless but you are doing such a good job. Hopefully his test will come back good. I agree with giving him the horn or silky worms if your going to have to force feed anyway. Better for him and should help you collect the poop sooner. also good for the hydration.

 

[pssh]

Have you been weighing him? If he isnt loosing weight I wouldnt worry about it too much.

Will he take food if you just pop a bug into his mouth? (like while he is drinking?) if you are really concerned about his calcium try some liquid calcium instead so you can just give him a drop every now and then while he is drinking water.

 

[DavidBuchan]

He is still pooping though, so he is still eating. How old is he? If the illness coincides with him naturally wanting less food then maybe it seems like a bigger drop than it has been. pssh is spot on, if he isn't losing weight from lack of appetite then it's really not much to worry about. My boy Rinty was not sick but still refused nearly all food for about 3 weeks........he started to eat again before loss of weight. If your guy is eating flies then believe me - he'll eat crickets if he gets hungry enough. Force feeding is not needed if he's not losing weight without it. Good luck with the recovery

 

[Alexl]

to promote an appetite wax worms!!! their high in fat so they act as a prevention to weight loss, a couple wax worms is better than nothing.

Fatty feeders are no good choice for already sick chameleons. They're not that easy to digest and you wouldn't eat french fries and burgers while being ill, don't you?

10 Crickets a day means 70 (!) feeders per week. Even the half would be too much for an nearly half a year old chameleon. A chameleon which suffers gut inflammation caused by coccidia can't digest all the feeders given properly, but those feeders will hurt in every little mucosal lesion and might even prevent the gut - which needs to carry those huge masses - from recovery. Therefore it's useless to give them so much food and fatty ones, too. An ill chameleon needs "normal" food, maybe additionally infusions by the vet. Feeders like green banana roaches or flying feeders (moths) are very attractive to most chameleons, so those would be the first to try for an ill one not eating. If he eats anything regularly, there's no need to forcefeed (aditional stress -> immunosuppressive -> good for the coccidia).

I made good experiences with probiotic bacteria to build up gut bacteria again after long or heavy treatments. We got some medical products over here containing e.g. Lactobacillus, maybe you might ask your vet about this option. You can even ask him/her about parasite free fecals from your own other healthy chameleons to instill into the ill one's gut (sounds disgusting but may help).

A chameleon who was well supplemented during his whole lifetime 'til the coccidia problem and whose cage has the right setup with enough UVB etc. will neither starve to death nor die from metabolic bone disease in some weeks. If he's eating soldier flys - great! That's better than refusing anything and helps a lot to keep the gut working. Talk to your vet about infusions with calcium and vitamins if you're worried or it's lasting really long. I'd suggest controlling his weight to have an overview about weight losing (or gaining), too.

Did you clean and disinfect the cage and keep the chameleon in quarantine to avoid reinfection? A coccidia problem continuing over months without improvement makes me thinking of this, too.

 

[GabeCastro]

Have you been weighing him? If he isnt loosing weight I wouldnt worry about it too much.

Will he take food if you just pop a bug into his mouth? (like while he is drinking?) if you are really concerned about his calcium try some liquid calcium instead so you can just give him a drop every now and then while he is drinking water.

He does take the food and starts biting it and gulps it down if i forcefeed. But the times he regurgitates it i let him be...

I'll email my vet about the liquid calcium. Maybe he can prescribe my something to help him out.

He is still pooping though, so he is still eating. How old is he? If the illness coincides with him naturally wanting less food then maybe it seems like a bigger drop than it has been. pssh is spot on, if he isn't losing weight from lack of appetite then it's really not much to worry about. My boy Rinty was not sick but still refused nearly all food for about 3 weeks........he started to eat again before loss of weight. If your guy is eating flies then believe me - he'll eat crickets if he gets hungry enough. Force feeding is not needed if he's not losing weight without it. Good luck with the recovery

Jaspers about 7 months old. My vet told me to not introduce him any food for 4 days then throw in some crickets to see if he'll eat the crickets. Just did that today but he didn't go for the crickets. Just watched it walk up to him and ran away. But he's been eating the soldier flies.

He also doesn't close his eyes during the day or anything, so i think he's just having a hard time with the coccidia/pinworms. They do make it hard for chameleons to digest their food properly. And they also take all the nutrients away from the feeders. So by the time the chameleon passes them through, they barley get anything out from it. The panacure is suppose to help kill off the pinworms, he'll get rid of those by pooping. I've heard giving him kerns papaya juice will help him out, so i'll give that a try.

Fatty feeders are no good choice for already sick chameleons. They're not that easy to digest and you wouldn't eat french fries and burgers while being ill, don't you?

10 Crickets a day means 70 (!) feeders per week. Even the half would be too much for an nearly half a year old chameleon. A chameleon which suffers gut inflammation caused by coccidia can't digest all the feeders given properly, but those feeders will hurt in every little mucosal lesion and might even prevent the gut - which needs to carry those huge masses - from recovery. Therefore it's useless to give them so much food and fatty ones, too. An ill chameleon needs "normal" food, maybe additionally infusions by the vet. Feeders like green banana roaches or flying feeders (moths) are very attractive to most chameleons, so those would be the first to try for an ill one not eating. If he eats anything regularly, there's no need to forcefeed (aditional stress -> immunosuppressive -> good for the coccidia).

I made good experiences with probiotic bacteria to build up gut bacteria again after long or heavy treatments. We got some medical products over here containing e.g. Lactobacillus, maybe you might ask your vet about this option. You can even ask him/her about parasite free fecals from your own other healthy chameleons to instill into the ill one's gut (sounds disgusting but may help).

A chameleon who was well supplemented during his whole lifetime 'til the coccidia problem and whose cage has the right setup with enough UVB etc. will neither starve to death nor die from metabolic bone disease in some weeks. If he's eating soldier flys - great! That's better than refusing anything and helps a lot to keep the gut working. Talk to your vet about infusions with calcium and vitamins if you're worried or it's lasting really long. I'd suggest controlling his weight to have an overview about weight losing (or gaining), too.

Did you clean and disinfect the cage and keep the chameleon in quarantine to avoid reinfection? A coccidia problem continuing over months without improvement makes me thinking of this, too.

Thanks for the great reply, I have been cleaning his cage out. Everytime i spot a poop on the floor i clean it up with 40% peroxide. Also i've been taking Jasper out his cage and spraying it down with the peroxide aswell. I let the peroxide sit for a good 10 minutes, spray it down with water really well then put Jasper back in.

As for him not eating, Just recently he started eating soldier flies. This past month he's probably eaten about 5 crickets (force fed) and a few super worms (forcefed), hornworms, and 1 small silkworm (forcefed).

He doesn't go for anything unless it flies. I do want to try keeping banana roaches, but i've heard they're a pain to keep...Plus they're a bit expensive but it's worth a shot I guess.

And about the waxworms comment, my vet told me to not feed him these. They can cause food strikes, and a whole bunch of other problems. I guess the fat can cause similar issues like sinus infections to chameleons.

Overall Jasper looks and moves around great. Doesn't seem weak or looks like he's insanely skinny. Still looks the same, limbs look good, etc. I'll go get a scale for him, hopefully figure out how much he weights and make sure he's not going downhill.

I'm just worried about him getting to the point where i'm not giving him enough calcium supplements. I don't want him to get MBD. Also my vet gave him a vitamin/calcium shot his last visit (about a month ago). You think I would need another shot for this next visit? i plan on dropping off a fecal sample sometime this week.

 

[Alexl]

Thanks for the great reply, I have been cleaning his cage out. Everytime i spot a poop on the floor i clean it up with 40% peroxide. Also i've been taking Jasper out his cage and spraying it down with the peroxide aswell. I let the peroxide sit for a good 10 minutes, spray it down with water really well then put Jasper back in.

This could be one reason for the long lasting problem. Most coccidia have a really strong ability to survive. I don't think spraying the cage equipment and waiting only ten minutes will destroy their infectious stages properly. I always advise people to keep their coccidia infected chameleon in another quarantine cage until at least three fecals in some weeks are free. Meanwhile owners should clean and disinfect (disinfecting is uselesss if not cleaned and dried again before) the cage. I even advice people to replace the whole equipment inside the cage. Everything that was used inside the "coccidia cage" should be thrown into garbage and then you build up a completely coccidia free cage. This may sound odd to you first, but branches and plants can't be cleaned and disinfected properly. It's just a big source of reinfection and even a small number of left oocysts will be enough to infect your chameleon again. Well, that's the safest way to get rid of these parasites. I use p-chloro-m-cresole for the cage, which is one of few disinfectants coccidia aren't resistant to. But it should be used very, very carefully and always under veterinary survey.

By the way, which coccidia has he? Some species, e.g. Choleoeimera, can stay in the gall bladder, which means treatment can take a really long time sometimes and chameleons may have parasite free feces, but the infection is still going on.

As for him not eating, Just recently he started eating soldier flies. This past month he's probably eaten about 5 crickets (force fed) and a few super worms (forcefed), hornworms, and 1 small silkworm (forcefed).

I don't see any reason to forcefeed your chameleon at all. This amount is ok for your chameleon up to date. Just let him recover slowely.

I'm just worried about him getting to the point where i'm not giving him enough calcium supplements. I don't want him to get MBD. Also my vet gave him a vitamin/calcium shot his last visit (about a month ago).

As long as he's eating as you told me before and has proper cage setup, especially proper UVB, your chameleon will not get metabolic bone disease. He gets vitamines and calcium in addition from your vet. Don't worry too much about him. This sickness doesn't come over you like a plague of insects suddenly tomorrow .

 

[GabeCastro]

Yesterday I let it sit for 20 minutes, hit it with water then another 10 minutes with peroxide then washed it out with water again. When I said a good ten minutes I meant nothing less than 10 minutes. Sometimes 15, 20, etc. and I always spray it down more than once.

I bought brand new everything when I found out he has coccidia. Not sure on what type he has, didn't know there was more than one.

Jasper's cage is bare, one big focus tree and a jungle vine. I clean it out every week. Allot of members told me what to do, and they've had success getting rid of coccidia so I'm following their instructions. Even my vet said I'm doing fine.

Only thing I'm worried about is jasper not eating and not getting his supplements.